Africa Plains Game Hunt

I'm in the preliminary stages of planning an African Safari (Researching Outfitters) and since it's in the off-season, hopefully this will spark some conversation. I haven't nailed down exactly what I want to hunt yet, but do have several ideas. Being that I'll be on a poor-boy budget - I won't be able to hunt everything I'd like to. One of my thought's is a Spiral-Horn Slam: Kudu; Nyala; Eland; and Bushbuck. Other interest that are high on my list are; Gemsbok; Impala; Wildebeest (Blue and Black); Warthog; Zebra; Waterbuck; and Springbok. I wouldn't be against other animals of opportunity.

I'm interested in experiencing all the methods of hunting in Africa: Safari-style; spot-n-stalk; setting in blinds over waterholes...etc. I'm also planning on trying to video the hunt if possible - which I know will not be easy (my wife may take up my slack here). I'm primarily wanting to hunt with revolvers, but I'm not against carrying a single shot along. I have: 41 mag; 44 mag; 45 Colt; 454 Casull; 480 Ruger; and 475 Linebaugh calibers to choose from in revolvers. some of those are scoped, some red-dots, and some iron sights. In the encore platform I have 308 Winchester (2x7 burris)and 270 Winchester (4x12 burris) barrels.

With the given info, I'd love to hear recommendations/comments on outfitters you've used, recommendations on revolver/caliber, recommendations on encore calibers, along with bullets recommendations and preferred time of year to hunt.

I really value the veteran Africa hunters opinions here and look forward to a good discussion. Any helpful tips as far as getting guns into country or anything else I may have missed will also be greatly appreciated.

If there's bad experience you've encountered and don't want to post publicly, please PM me so as to steer clear of them.

I can?t offer any advice, except to read Billa?s three-part story on his African hunt. It looked like a great time. Other than that, enjoy every minute from Planning to returning and telling us all about it! Most of us will never make that dream hunt, so make the most of every second!

KRAL: JUST A QUICK POST, 1) YOUR ANIMAL LIST IS FULL OF HIGH DOLLAR ANIMALS, 2) LEAVE THE WATERBUCK AND WILDEBEEST FOR ANOTHER TIME, 3) MAKE SURE KUDU AND GEMSBOK ARE AVAILABLE ON YOUR HUNT, 4) IMPALA AND WARTHOGS ARE AFFORDABLE AND USUALLY AVAILABLE IN MOST PLACES, 5) FOR PLAINS GAME WITH HANDGUNS YOUR OPTIONS ARE PROBABLY SOUTH AFRICA AND MAYBE ZIMBABWE, 6) HUNTING FROM PERMANENT BLINDS IS NOT "TRADITIONAL" AFRICAN, HUNTING FROM "HIDES" MADE OUT OF/USING NATURAL BRUSH, SET UP AS AND WHEN REQUIRED, CAN BE "TRADITIOINAL". 7) OTHER THAN USING THE OCASSIONAL HIDE, YOU USUALLY DRIVE AROUND AND CAN EITHER SHOOT FROM THE VEHICLE OR GET OFF AND DO SPOT AND STALK, THE LATTER BEING MY FAVORITE, 8) MANY OF THE OUTFITTERS HUNT OTHER PEOPLE'S RANCHES, AND MORE THAN 1 OF THEM, AND 9) THERE ARE GUYS HERE THAT CAN PROBABLY GIVE YOU GOOD REFERENCES, BASED UPON RECENT EXPERIENCES, FOR OUTFITTERS.

Following this one closely.. I've got intentions to do the same in the coming few years time. Myself, I am most interested in Kudu & Gemsbok, maybe a Warthog, and possibly impala. That's as far as I got with my own list for Africa thus far.

Intend to do mine with my 41

Kim, If South Africa is your destination, there are many, many outfitters marketing hunts. And the prices for game in SA are the lowest I've seen in a number of years. At the SCI Convention, I will guess there are 40-50 outfitters from SA alone. Most offer good hunting opportunities.

Only you can determine which animals turn your crank. My suggestion -- sell a kidney, rob a bank (Just kidding!) borrow money, deplete the kid's college fund, or whatever it takes to shoot all you possibly can.

Take whatever gun/guns you feel most comfortable shooting. Depending on your location or animals preferred, your shooting distance may vary.

Fair warning -- Africa is addictive. I've never used drugs but they may have been cheaper than 29 hunts in Africa!!

JDK, thanks for the read reference, but I?m afraid I probably read every article and forum ever written on handgun hunting Africa....lol. Just hoping to get a good compilation of info here.

REY, thanks for the quick spill. Any particular reason you not suggest hunting waterbuck or wildebeest?

Thanks for the advice, Mark. I'm intending to make what may be my one and only opportunity to hunt Africa, worth it. I'm thinking 6-8 animals, if possible.

Good for you.... Wish I was going ? Get what you can. The last two times I went I had to have my revolvers scoped when applying for the permits. When I got there I removed them and installed the iron sights... The laws are always changing.. Go through a company like Air 2000...

Kral, I think you are only allowed 2 handguns in South Africa, when I went you could take three. Also they must be scoped, can be a red dot, etc.
I wore a money belt with my money inside a plastic bag & the bag inside the money belt because of sweat. I also went to a SA bank & got one of each of the 5 SA bills so I could frame them. They have the big 5 animals on them, makes a nice "trophy" when put in a picture frame. Shoot a couple of extra animals, you'll be glad you did!!!

Dick

For PH. No contest. Andrew Renton of Keiriverhuntingsafaris.co.za. I've been to him my last 4 times. Quality of game unreal. Over half of animals are top 15. The worst is $35. My Cape kudu is #2. He loves handgun hunters. His prices are very reasonable. Polite, kind man that gets respect from all land owners and staff. Accomodations excellent. Has access close to 1 million acres of hunting.
My next trip will be with him.
I've taken 3 handguns on each trip. That's till OK. I take 2 XPs and one revolver with scopes. Never a problem.
Spot and stalk is Andrew's preferred method in the East Cape- no fences there. Backpack, BogPOd with PSR, and offhand shots are used the most. The African wooden tripods are not handgunner friendly.

I have been extremely happy with my safaris with bobby hansen safaris. He has a great property in south africa. Huge and likely wont need to ever leave it. If he knows youre on a budget he will find you some older animals that habe lots of character at a great price. Got my last cape buff under 5k and shot blue wildebeest for 400 bucks. Hes got great book animals if youre into that. Most of mine were gold medal animals and would be in the book. None of the animals you listed require a solid and so i would bring a 454 with swift a frames running hard and a single shot in case you cant get in close on some animals. He will hunt anyway you want. Here would be my list on a budget. Gemsbok, kudu, blue wildebeest, springbok, blesbok, impala, eland, ad an nyala as you can afford. They are beautiful. Bushbuck are fine as well. Ad a red hartebeest in there as well.

Definitely consider Nyala!



I was also very happy with my outfitter, Tollie's African Safaris. He's very reasonably priced across the board, there is an abundance of game there, the food is off the charts fantastic, and he delivers.

THIS IS GREAT NEWS KIM!!!! I'm so happy for you brother...Give em hell buddy

Awesome. Good luck Kim. Can't wait to see the videos. I've watched everyone of yours on YouTube.

In 2014 I did an Eastern Cape hunt with Andy Renton. Have to agree with WVHITMAN, he's a great PH for handgun hunters. He's a bow hunter and knows everything there is to know about how to stalk into range.

Whoever you choose as outfitter, make sure you use a meet & greet firearms permit service to walk you through the import process.

Awesome Kim

KRAL: IF A WATERBUCK ISN'T 30 INCHES PLUS IT IS JUST ANOTHER ANTELOPE, YOUR CHANCES OF GETTING A 30 INCHER ON A HUNT WITH A BIG HIT LIST ARE REMOTE. THE WILDEBEESTS ARE JUST GOOFY, SPEND YOUR MONEY ON SOMETHING NICER, LIKE SPIRAL HORNS, OR A BIG, PRICEY SABLE.

Good luck Kim.

I am excited for you!

And I am looking forward to the pics and videos!

I've not hunted them, but I like the look of the wildebeest. It would be a sharp looking mount IMO. That said, there are myriad beautiful animals in Africa. Why can't it be like the old days where you spend a year roaming the wilds and bring back hundreds of "specimens" !

I saw Craig Boddington at an Annual NRA convention before I went over to Namibia. He was very helpful, and one piece of advice was really great. Wear your hunting boots over, or at least put in your carry-on luggage.

Your guns or ammo my get lost, but you can always borrow these. Same with clothing. I f lost can be replaced. BUT try finding a pair of boots that fit....good luck.

Max, that Nyala is a beauty!

Ruger4570, that's some sound advice - thanks!

Trademark, thanks for the info. The 454 was actually my unspoken #1 pick - was just curious what other suggestions I might get. I'm not ruling out the proven A-frames, but I have good supply of 260 and 300gr Nosler Partitions that are wanting to play.

Which brings up another question - would the 260's over max dose of H110 be more desirable with the it's fast/flat shooting capability or the 300gr over max load of H110 with a little more weight and less velocity?

I think either load would work fine but lean toward the 300.

300 gr....if Eland is on the list...300 gr

The eland I took was a big animal. For sure a 300... Otherwise for smaller plains the 260`s running fast will do the job. The last time I paid for hartebeest and buff but left Africa with a total of six animals..... Its amazing what you`ll see..

BETWEEN A 260 AND A 300, FOR AFRICA, DEFINITELY GO WITH THE 300. IF YOU HIT THE ANIMAL ITS YOURS, AND YOU PAY FOR IT, EVEN IF IT IS NOT RECOVERED, SO WITH REVOLVERS YOU BETTER NOT TRY ANY LONG RANGE SHOOTING, 100 YARDS MAX, CLOSER TO FIFTY A LOT BETTER, AND AT THOSE RANGES A 30O GRAINER WILL SHOOT FLAT ENUFF.

Exactly!

Kral,
There has been a load of good advice posted here. Experiences from perhaps 100 handgun safaris. I have only been there once but it was the greatest! As far as animals go, everyone has their opinion of course but being on a limited budget what I did was prioritize. My dream animal was Kudu, then Impala. After that I was flexible. I shot a Blesbok, Blue Wildebeest and 2 Warthogs. These 6 made for a great hunt. There are many other affordable options- Springbok, Reedbuck, Bushbuck, Gemsbuck. As far as the hunt goes, we did spot and stalk. The mountain top Kudu Hunt was awesome. I really enjoyed stalking Warthogs. The hunting was in thick cover and it reminded me of deer hunting in the US.
If I go again I will likely use the same outfitter - EAI Outdoors - But you should check out the others mentioned before you choose. In regards to overall cost consider your taxidermy carefully. Taxidermy can exceed your animal costs. One of the reasons I chose my outfitter is that they have an on site taxidermist. They take care of everything and I was happy with the results.
Here are a few key items I suggest:
-Use a service to get your guns through at the airport.
-Wear your hunting boots on the plane along with other must have items.
-Carry on what you can. Use your hunting backpack and a briefcase for your personal item.
-Pack as much as you can in your gun box. Binoculars, knives, rangefinder. I removed a layer of foam and put some clothes in the bottom. Get a good case. Airlines try hard not to lose guns!
-I also put my guns in zipper cases inside the gun box for extra protection
-Take your own shooting sticks. I used the traditional wooden (bamboo actually) but I planned for it and took a clamp on brace that I made for wrist support. It worked great. I practiced with it on wooden sticks for a year to get it right.
-Use heavy bullets for full penetration on your largest animal. All shots are center shoulder. I almost took a facing head shot on a feeding Warthog but he turned at the last minute.

AMEN TO THE HEAVIER BULLETS, e.g, 300gr vs 260gr, AND AMEN TO CENTER SHOULDER! I SHOT AN IMPALA HEAD ON WITH A 375-06 JDJ, USING A SWIFT 250 AFRAME, AT WAY OVER 2,000fps, AND IT TOOK THE TRACKERS A LONGTIME TO FIND IT. MY EXPERIENCE WITH FRONTAL SHOTS IS USUALLY NOT TO MY SATISFACTION, WHILE MY EXPERIENCE WITH SHOULDER SHOTS, ESPECIALLY BROADSIDE, IS ROUTINELY EXCELLENT.

Good information, gentlemen! I had pretty much decided on what I was going to carry and what bullets i was going to shoot, I just wanted to spark some good conversation. So far - so good.
For revolver selection, my main gun is probably going to be my FA M83 454 casull with 7.5" barrel topped with a 2.5x8 leupold. Probably going to be shooting a 300gr Nosler Partition over a max dose of H110. Haven't totally decided on belt gun yet, but one option is my FA M97 with 5.5" barrel topped with a jpoint reflex sight shooting a 260gr Nosler Partition over 18 or so grains of 2400. Thoughts?

Bill thanks for the great pointers. I'll be thinking a while on the taxidermy aspect. Deciding between having it done in Africa and shipped back, shipping back hide and skulls to have my taxidermist do it, or have it shipped back and doing it myself.
I'd love to here the pro's and con's from several different members on this.

If your wife is going you could take another gun or 2 if you wish. When I went to SA it was a 2 gun limit and they were to be different cartridges. They may need to be in separate cases from the other 2.

That's something to think about! That hasn't crossed my mind, but very good idea. Thanks!

KRAL: GOOD CHOICE FOR THE MAIN GUN AND LOAD, CANNOT COMMENT ON THE 2400 LOAD FOR THE MODEL 97 (IN 45 COLT I GUESS?). I BELIEVE THE TAXIDERMY IS BETTER HERE THAN THERE. WHILE LESS EXPENSIVE THERE, IT COSTS MORE TO SHIP MOUNTED TROPHIES THAN HIDE, HORNS AND SKULLS. IF YOU CAN DO YOUR OWN TAXIDERMY, AND KNOW HOW A PARTICULAR MOUNT SHUD LOOK, GO FOR IT, JUST BECAUSE A GUY IS GOOD ON WHITETAILS DOESN'T MEAN HE KNOWS HOW THE DIFFERENT AFRICAN ANTELOPES SHUD LOOK.

AS A FIRST TIMER, YOU MAY NOT KNOW WHAT A TROPHY ("BOOK") ANIMAL SHUD LOOK LIKE. THE GUIDES ARE IN TO SELLING ANIMALS AND IF YOU ARE HAPPY WITH A NON-BOOK ANIMAL, THEY WILL PAT YOU ON THE BACK, TELL YOU "WELL DONE", TAKE A LOT OF PICTURES, AND YOU WILL END UP WITH THE EQUIVALENT OF AN OK YOUNG 8 POINT WHITETAIL ON YOUR WALL. BE CAREFUL, YOU SHUD INSIST THAT EVERY ANIMAL BE "BOOK" SIZE, AFTER ALL YOU ARE USUALLY PAYING THE SAME TROPHY FEE WHETHER IT MAKES BOOK OR NOT. NOW IF THEY TELL YOU IT IS A CULL, AND CHARGE ACCORDINGLY, THAT IS SOMETHING ELSE. GET THE SCI AFRICAN EDITION BOOK, IT WILL GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHAT IS BOOK FOR EACH ANIMAL, WHAT TO MEASURE, AND I BELIEVE THEY STILL HAVE A HANDGUN SECTION FOR MOST AFRICAN GAME. FOR YOUR TRIP COPY A FEW PAGES OUT OF THE BOOK FOR ANY ANIMAL YOU MAY WISH TO TRY AND TAKE, MAKES FOR A HANDY REFERENCE/STUDY GUIDE.

Rey, yes it?s 45 colt. The 260 NP shoots extremely well in that gun. I think within 75 yards, that combo would work well. Should be putting that bullet out around 1300+FPS from the M97. Thanks for the SCI reference suggestion, I may have to check that out.

That 45 colt will work ok for small stuff up close. These animals are tough and a marginal hit with marginal power makes for an expensive hike. Bobby hansen will only allow excellent examples or old animals to be taken. He almost would t let me shoot a 32? waterbuck. He knows after a few safaris i am truly happy with old worn animals with character so if theyre available then he will let me take them. He hates african buyers remorse. Every year he gets a couple 60? kudu. He has very very exceptional animals.

Thanks, Mark. Yeah, if the 45 got to play, it would be in an idea situation...i.e. on an Impala or similar sized and maybe sitting over a waterhole where shots could be close. The little M97 just doesn't play well with hot 45 colt loads - it gets really fussy, quick.

Really, i always kinda wanted one but wasnt sure about how it did with the heavier loads. Thanks!

It shoots them well, but gets kinda lively. I've been shoot'n 250xtp's over 20gr 0f 2400 and it's manageable. It's just not as much to hold onto as with the M83.

Max, What?s the detail on the equipment used on this beautiful Nyala?

Thank you. BFR in .454 with a 6 1/2-inch barrel. It was topped with a fixed 4x Leupold scope (I removed it right after this hunt and mounted an Ultradot as the 4x was too hard to get on quickly for me). I was using Federal 300 grain A-frame loads.

Did you get full penetration with those?

I haven?t decided on an outfitter yet, but have looked at several on the www. I come across some very reasonable prices and some that are pricey! I?ve not fully decide on what I want to hunt yet, but I?m leaning very strong on a Spiral Horn Grand Slam: Eland; Kudu; Nyala; and Bushbuck with Impala and Zebra maybe as targets of opportunity. Leaning in this direction, I?m probably taking my FA 454 stoked with a 300gr Nosler Partition or A-Frame pushed with a healthy dose of H110. That will cover anything within 100 yards and I hope to take all with a revolver.....but, this will be my first trip to Africa, so I?m prolly carrying along a ?Crutch? just to be safe. As stated before, I have encore barrels in 308 win and 270 win. Both shoot well. The 308 has a 2x7 Burris and the 270 has a 4x12 Burris with arrestor brake. The 308 can obviously handle the heavier weight bullets, but will that be necessary with the game at hand?
Which caliber, what bullet, and why, would you choose? I?ve always used Nosler Ballistic tips for whitetail and they work very well for me, but I think a better constructed bullet is merited here.

KRAL: CRUTCHES MAKE YOU A CRIPPLE, REVOLVER IT ALL THE WAY! MY EXPERIENCE IN AFRICA IS THAT A 454 KILLS ABOUT THE SAME AS A 300 WIN MAG, WITH PREMIUM 180gr - 200gr BULLETS, OUT OF A RIFLE, YOUR 308 AND 270 OUT OF AN ENCORE PISTOL WUD BE BIG STEPS DOWN, NOT A STEP UP.

The analogy ive been told is that the 454 with 325 aframes kills like a 375 hh on african plains game. Mine run around 1630 fps or so. The ones you listed with the exception of the bushbuck will be easy to get with a revolver. Go to the right property and rhe bushbuck will be easy as well. Ive seen all of the above mentioned animals at 30 yards or less with the exception of the bushbuck.

Learnt something new again re-reading this thread.. handguns must be scoped for Africa!? You're kidding.

James; you say it's no problem to remove them once at the destination... so I assume it's a travel/airlines/enter to country stipulation more than something the outfitter necessitates??

Gotta be honest, I haven't got a single-one with a scope! Traditional iron-sight shooter myself. May have to go shopping for a temporary one to at least get into country tho by the sounds of it.

Good info, Mark. I know James has taken Bushbuck with a revolver, so it's not impossible. Topography and terrain will have a lot to do with it.

Rey, the purpose of the crutch wasn't necessarily for the killing power, but for the extra yard or two I could shoot if animals didn't cooperated with being killed with the revolver. You know sometime they're just hard headed.

I've seen conflicting post within this thread on how many guns can be taken to SA and I'm sure both are correct to some extent.
Several have stated that only two can be carried, while Doc Rogers has been several times and carried three each time. So far I haven't found anything definite in writing and it probably changes with the wind. I also haven't talked to any outfitters yet. I'm hoping I will not be limited to two, because I'd like to take a backup/alternate revolver just for when murphy shows up.

BTW, I HAVE TAKEN 4 BOOK BUSHBUCK, ALL WITH REVOLVERS, AND IF YOUR ANIMAL ISN'T CLOSE ENUFF KEEP HUNTING (STALKING), THAT IS WHERE THE REAL FUN BEGINS.

Ya can't argue with that!

I?m pretty sure you are limited to two handguns. It?s easy enough to find out. I agree with Rey, stalking close is where the fun begins - at least that?s why I do this.

I brought my .500 JRH for DG and the .454 for plains game, but either could have fulfilled both roles. I planned it that way.

An optic (scope or red dot) is required for South Africa. Not sure about the other countries. I know a few folks who remove the optics as soon as they get to their hunting destination.

Now you can take two and some meet and greet will tell you only one handgun. I used and have used a few times now gracy travel and their meet and greet through customs is the best. One of the reasons i love a super redhawk because a red dot a scope and irons are always available and easily switched. I have night sights on mine and that way i can use a scope or reddot at a waterhole if it might be a longer shot and i take it off at night running around or going in after anything.

KRAL: SOME NICE SPIRAL HORNS YOU NEED TO TRY FOR, A GOOD NYALA FLANKED BY 2 GOOD BUSHBUCKS, ALL TAKEN WITH HEAVY 45 COLT LOADS (454 EQUIVALENT), IN 45 COLT CYLINDERS, IN 454 FA REVOLVERS.

My second gun for my SA trip was a Redhawk 44 Mag. Topped with a B&L 4x scope. It was a good open country option had my Contender broke down. I removed the scope when I got there and carried on my belt with iron sights. Since you are not a scope guy I suggest a no gunsmith mount with a red dot. I think the rational on the SA end is that you are bringing hunting guns not military or defense weapons. The SA police check serial numbers against your paperwork and look at the guns. Your only issues are in the airport or cities. While hunting iron sights should be fine.

I've taken 3 handguns on 9 Africa trips. Approved every time!!

The planning for a hunt is half the fun, enjoy it!

I will be watching with interest and living vicariously as usual

So Much great knowledge and experience on this site. Its fun just to read the suggestions from everyone

Exactly! Which was the full intent of this thread - get as much input and compiled information in one place as possible.

If I can join the conversation. We are heading to South Africa in late August. My outfitter is Africa Maximum Safaris. Prices are way down compared to a couple years ago when my plans changed and I couldn?t make the trip. I will give everyone a report when I return. My fianc? and I were told we could take two guns apiece. We are taking two pistols. An XP in 6.5 Saum and an HS in 7 Saum.
I went over in 2005 on a bow hunting safari and some of the prices were the same or higher back then! Our trip will be all spot n stock and we are really looking forward to this trip.
KRal, no matter what guns you choose. Animals you take. Africa is a magical place you will never forget and will more than likely return too.
Derek. >>>???->

This sentiment I agree with 1,000 %!

Good luck to you, Derek. Look forward to a full report upon your return!

KRal, As mentioned, when I went it was 3 guns & they had to be scoped but later when some friends went it had changed to 2 guns, scoped.
One thing you can do is borrow a long gun from your PH & shoot it after you get there if you need to, they will have plenty, trust me! My PH was packing a plain jane 308! I guarantee you will handgun everyone of them. Good luck buddy!

Dick

Welcome!
have a great time!

Ditto. Africa is just awesome!!

Dick,
I?m not sure I can shoot a rifel...or is it rifle...I?m not even sure I can spell it .😜

I?ve been researching a lot on the gun count and from what I?ve found - their laws state no more than four firearms which can?t be of the same caliber. I?ve also found that it doesn?t seem to be a law dictating scopes on handguns, but rather highly suggested to simplify the importing process. I will not chance my firearms being confiscated and they will be scoped. That being said, I haven?t researched any of the airline regulations. There may be some airlines that will not fly more than two handguns, which may be where the two handgun limit comes from.

Exciting stuff Kim! Looking forward to see what you get squared away for the trip...talk with our buddy Darrell for his input on game, gear and outfitters

Will do and have done😜

Thanks Ernie,
I like this sight also. Derek >>>----->

Does anyone have a valid email contact for Bobby Hansen Safaris? I've tried his email listed on his website and the "contact us" feature with both giving me returned/error notifications.

Bump.

The one i use to contact him is bhsafari@iafrica.com. It worked for me last week.

Thanks, Mark. I?ll give that a try.

Well, I?ve been doing a lot of research on plains game safaris and have learned there?s hunts out there for everyone. Some are inexpensive, some are reasonable and some are ....well, WAY out of my price range. I?ve found some hunts that a seven day hunt, before trophy fees, cost more than a ten day hunt with ten animals trophy fees at another outfitter. If you haven?t researched the opportunities in Africa - it?s mind boggling! I?ve narrowed down my choices to about eight or ten outfitters so far. It?s still going to be about twelve months out before I hunt, so I won?t be jumping onboard any particular outfitter just yet. I?m still open to suggestions and experience.

I think that wherever you decide to hunt, you should try out your decided plains game hunt gun/load combination in April in Ohio on our next Forum Hunt

If l?m able, I just may do that. So far, all of your dates in the past conflicted with work...work always gets in the way of everything!

It's all good buddy....it will eventually work out

David if you could also move Ohio closer to Texas, that?d be great.

Brother, if I could, I certainly would