Anyone using H-4227 in their 480?

All the talk about Lil Gun got me thinking about H-4227 in the 480.
I have NOT seen any signs of erosion in my 480 with the Lil Gun. H-110 was giving me erratic velocities in cool temps no matter what primers I tried.
I didn't have H-4227 on the shelf so I never tried it. Used to use it in other handguns with good results. Anyone using it with 400ish hardcast? How is velocity & consistency?

I did a lot of testing with 4227 and found that it will raise pressure/velocity as your gun heats up...like 200fps+/-.

I researched it further and found that this was common knowledge among the IMSHA comunitee. I know if you test a few rounds you can be miss-lead into thinking it is good pistol powder, but it is not.

Accuracy will be great one time with 4227. But then you try it again and it will be all over the place. I proved this to myself with the 44mag, the 475L and the 480R...but where it really shows up is at long range with the 460S&W.

You have to keep pouring the H110 into the case until it melows. It is not your primer, it is the fact that h110/296 has a specific pressure that it burns well at. Until you reach this pressure it will show up to 140fps extreme spread from shot to shot, especially with the sedated loads of the modern reloading manuals.

Case in point..my old Hodgdon manual list 26 grains as max in a 44 mag with 240JFP and some new manuals list 22gr as max. When the perfect working pressure is reached it will drop to the single digits...like 6 fps extreme spread. Example: my 44 with a 280castGC needs 25gr 296 to give me 6fps extreme spread in one gun(both Rugers)and in the other SBHH it takes just a little more to obtain this extreme spread result.

Thanks Freedom.
I may play with H-110 a bit more. I was playing with book max loads so we will see. My experience with H-110 velocity in cold weather was a lot like what you are talking about with a hot gun & 4227.
Being in Alaska the gun heating up isn't a problem I routinely experience.

Anyone else have opinions on 4227 in the 480?

I just went through a few of my old(er)6years+/-ago) notes...I had just a handfull of 400gr LBT WFN's that a friend gave me to chrono test for him. I only had 4 rounds for each powder tested and this was in a 475Linebaugh 6" FA83

These notes tell me very little except the bullet and the powder. I have not even looked at a manual to verify this info... So don't use this as data!..

The picture and notes tell me that I pulled one shot and one bullet started to keyhole but the other 2 went through the target in the same hole at 25yards resting over the hood of my truck.

My notes said there was lots of un-burnt powder.

The 475L info was 22gr of H4227 and the chrono data was as follows 1115fps, 1114fps, 1115fps, 1111fps for an Extreme spread of 4fps!!!

This info should/could make my first post BS...but I know from further testing with this powder that it changed...especially with the 460S&W at longer 100-200yard ranges.

I just couldn't make it work the exact same twice. Groups would always shift and the FPS and ES would grow to over 200fps as my gun heated up. Seemed it would shoot a little tiny group...go check target, reload and try again, this time the group would be somewhere else entirely and double in size???

I read that there are a lot of guys that use/like 4227. So maybe you will get some better info that I can't provide....or maybe those are the same guys that fire 10 rounds at 15yards and say "one of the best powder ever!..lol)

One of my friends that I have shot with is the Ballistics tech at Western...He shared some primer testing data with me and by only changing primers he was able to raise pressures from 22K with the RemLP to 35K with CCI350's!!!! I believe this was with a 500L...

So we REALLY need to be careful when testing a High-pressure cartridge like the 480R...seems things can get way out of control in a hurry! And this is the reason some Manual Data can seem low. The published data has to work within the pressure specks with the hottest primer, highest temp, etc. available

Thanks.
I have been using WW as my primary primers. Have several thousand. experimented with others but saw no improvements.

H 4227 is suposed to be one of there extreme powders,less temp sensitive than IMR.

The CCI-350 I think is the hottest American made magnum primer by far. I think John Linebaugh discovered the same pressure spikes when using Hornady testing equipment.

I doubt you will ever see peak pressure spikes with other American made magnum pistol primers, as you will see with those CCI-350's. Many years ago John Linebaugh recommended WLP's to me for use in the 500 Linebaugh Maximum and I've been very happen with their performance in all temperatures and with all powders.

I still have a good supply of CCI-350's and load them now & again in 44 mag and 45 Colt and I haven't been able to tell the difference relative to accuracy between the 350's and WLPs and Federal 155's.

In -20F I have found the WLP's and 155's set off H110 with the aforementioned cartridges just as well as the 350's, BUT if I knew I would only have one shot in the cold weather, I'd load with the CCI-350's every time, just cus.

Now for the OP's question, I sometimes use IMR-4227 in my 475 linebaugh and haven't found the accuracy to fall off with a hot barrel, but that's at 25 & 50 yards, as when shooting 100 yards I don't think my barrel gets really hot, as I don't shoot as fast or as many rounds as I do at the shorter ranges.

27.0 grains of 4227 with a 325 cast gets me 1,130fps, 26.0 grains with a 375 grain cast flies at 1,115fps and 21.0 grains with a 400 grain cast bullet goes a comfortable 920fps. This is from a 5.5" "cold/cool" barrel, as I normally fire over my chronograph with a cool barrel before I start shooting for group/score or minute of beer can.

Thanks to those who've added their experience to this thread. I'm interested in 4227 as well, but in the 475L as opposed to the 480. I've heard others say accuracy is quite good with bullets in the +/- 400-grain range in the 475 and imagine it might be likewise for the shorter round.

As for primer selection, I've heard of John's advice as well, stating magnum primers with HS-6 can boost pressure as much as 10k psi without any real gains in velocity. Right now I'm using standard primers with HS-6 and will switch to WLP's after my current stock runs out.

I would also suggest HS-6 in the .480 if you haven't yet tried it. You won't reach the velocity you'd get with 4227, but there's a lot of killing that can be done with a 400 grain hardcast running 1,000-1,100fps. Accuracy has been quite good in my 475L and I don't get beat up by the gun. What's not to like?

FWIW

Hogdon doesnt make H4227 any more,I asked them just IMR.

That is because the two are nearly identical, data is interchangeable.

What I dont understand is in the Sierra manual the IMR 4227 charges are 2 to 3 grs lower than Hogdons,I gave Sierra a call and they said the IMR was c load .I dont get it for there 240 gr bullet its almost a 2 two 3 gr heavier charge for H4227.That has to be c as well.

I see data for H110 and 296 in some manuals that aren't identical either, yet they are the same? Go figger. There is a nice article on 4227 and magnum handguns in the 2010 Hodgdon printed manual.