I wouldn't have any hesitations about shooting deer through the shoulder with the 240 grain XTP. They are not your average hollow point IMHO. Here are a couple of examples:

I shot this hog "quartering to me" in his right shoulder with a 240 grain XTP at only 1250 fps from my 209X50 Contender.

The shot took his front end out from under him and he pushed himself out of sight leaving a blood trail a blind man could follow. Upon examination, the bullet had completely broken the front shoulder and penetrated into his left ham. This hog had a very thick gristle shield and it is much harder to penetrate than a deers shoulder IMHO.

Here is another example using this MGM .44 Mag Contender which fires the 240 grain XTP at 1700 fps.

I shot this 150-175 lb bear with this gun using the 240 grain XTP.

The shot was at 25 yards and I hit him in his left shoulder, broadside. Reaction to the shot was incredible, he only lasted a few seconds and went down in sight. The shot penetrated both shoulders completely destroying the lungs in between. I found the bullet under the hide on his right shoulder and it was a magazine ad mushroom.

Thats good to know all jackted bullet do not stay together and penetration is comprimised. I know that the 300 grain XTP penetrates well today but di not in the 80's





Here are some jcketed hollow points and jackted flat points that did not penetrate well and some hollow points that did not expand

True, we agree.
I recovered all 240 gr XTP's and had almost no blood on the ground but I seen them go down. The small "in" hole does not bleed good.

JWP thats sure interesting were those from older bullets from the 80s you spoke of or more recent jacketed bullets?

JWP has things in hand. He really does agree and uses boolits in the same parameters that I do.
You can see failures and he shows them. There is a thin line between animal recovery and loss. Just how many kill recoveries are luck?
I will vouch for his experience, you should listen and stop listening to our little disagreements. I hate them and they are useless because we both do the same things in the end.
We carry things far out together but it is just between us. He is a good man and a friend. I will never give that up. We are really just pulling each others tail!

This is an interesting read. http://www.hawkbullets.com/Handgun.htm

Those are recent jacketedbullets. I know that the 300 grain XTP is a good penetrating bullet, but not sure about the 240

the 300 is significantly better than the 240 in the .44 mag realm, but if ya jump to the 454 the 240 xtp mags have held together and expanded well for me as well, nothing as good as the barnes imho on penetration or integrity, no expandable matches them that i have used.

I can agree with that, the mag XTP is a good bullet but they don't make a mag for the .44. I really like the 240 XTP for it's accuracy and expected more penetration on a behind the shoulder shot but I found all 3 bullets. They killed very, very well and fast. I was where I could see them go down but what worried me was when I back tracked them to where they were hit. I found almost no blood at all. Many places I hunt, the deer are out of sight in seconds and it is worse when they are shot at the last minutes of daylight and it gets dark when you look for them.
The 240 was designed to start to open at low velocities, even in the .44 special. Speed it up and it balloons quick into a perfect mushroom but that stops penetration. I would not want to hit big bones with it. Now I don't know what it does at 1700 FPS as far as being shot from a short rifle (TC pistol) but the added velocity should add to penetration. So we again get into comparing apples to oranges by bringing in different guns and different size animals.
Anyway I went to the 320 gr LBT for the .44 and never looked back. Blood starts at impact and you can run on the trail, the deer will be empty in 30 yards or less. Hit the shoulders and they drop. I hate to buy them so I made a mold and it came out 330 gr. It works the same. So does the 310 gr Lee and 300 gr LBT's and the RD 265 gr should be good.
Yes, hard works fine with lung shots from a .44 revolver but if you take the velocity real high with hard, shoot the shoulders.
I have been an archer all my life and it is hard to change where I shoot, you don't shoot arrows into shoulders. After over 250 deer with a bow, aim and shot is ingrown to behind the shoulder.
You see, it works two ways with high velocity and hard , over and above my hard boolit limit. Lung shots can fail so shoot the shoulders. Make the boolit expand and it is good in lungs. But maybe you don't want a shoulder hit with them!
This can happen from a revolver at high velocity and the perfect lung boolit if it hits a shoulder. I took the shoulder off and it was destroyed, you can see what it did to the rest of the carcass.

Now a shoulder shot with a hard boolit from the .475 at the velocity that works no matter where you shoot a deer.

I have shot many deer with 44mag's over the years and have never had any problems using xtp's.I even shot one doe with a 180xtp at over a 100 yards and had a complete pass through the ribs. Never recovered any 240xtp's on shoulder shots either. They work for me. These are all from revolver's.

If there is any doubt about the XTP there are two Aisian/Australian water buffalo on the bragging board taken with them. That is as big and tough of animal as there is short of rhino and elephant and then I'd take the punch bullet over anything else on the market. There are two versions of the XTP which still alot of people aren't aware of, one is the XTP Mag which has the jacket rolled over into the cup and the other is a standard HP design but either is effective on light game.

How do you explain these three 240 gr XTP bullets after no bone hits on deer that were found against the skin?

My deer must be huge with the largest at maybe 150# with the others hard to break 100#.
Funny how a 180 gr goes through huge animals.

as you've read by now your the exception and not the rule and that is the standard XTP and not the Mag design. But bottom line is use what you like let the guys know about what you've experienced or seen but as with anything there are two sides to the story.

That is true, it is not a mag XTP because Hornady does not make one for the .44. To get mag results you need to go to the 300 gr XTP. That will give two holes.
I have no beef with how well the 240 works, it is only that they can stop too fast. They might not go deep enough if big bone is hit. After using them I had to make a decision based on results I seen. I was not happy because I back track every deer looking at blood spoor. There is nothing more important then being able to track a deer. Here it is bad because there are a million tracks on trails. There MUST be blood on the ground.
Nothing is worse then being on your knees with a lantern after dark, looking for a speck of blood.
You can kill deer with anything but you have to find them.
I do not trust the 240 XTP to give two holes.

I shot this small hog about 3 months ago with a .480 Ruger, 412 grain cast bullet, 1200 fps.


The bullet entered on the hog's right side about where my cylinder is lying on his shoulder. The exit can be seen in the photo in front of its left ham. I could not find a single drop of blood and had to trail it blindly. It only ran about 50 yards into a mountain laurel thicket and I recovered the hog without incident.

Even though there was no blood trail, I don't consider this a failure of the load.

I killed another hog with the same load just a couple of hours after that kill.


There was no trailing needed on that one. After the first shot it ran toward me and I shot it again; it died in sight. I plan to hunt deer, hogs, and black bear with this same load during this year's hunting trips when the .480 Ruger gets carried.

I consider a load effective if it kills the animal efficiently and I recover the animal without incident (provided that I make a good shot to the vitals). To have deer falling in sight after they were shot with a 240 grain XTP fits my definition of a successful load!

If you stop an animals heart with the shot there will be very little blood loss. When you stop the pump pressure drops immediately.A deer dies from lack of oxygen to the brain the same as we do.If a deer has just taken in a breath they can cover 100 yards easily before the brain shuts down, with no blood trail[ no pump]. If the shot is up on the body there will be no leakage either,all the blood will pool in the body. I prefere two holes so I get that leakage. The only sure way to drop one in its tracks is to disrupt the spinal system. The bullets you show did exactly what they were designed to do,drive deep,found under skin on off side, [adaquet penetration]expanded to almost double in size and disrupt vital organs. With deer hide being so elastic it probaly stretched 6 inches on the off side ,bullet had to much frontal area to punch through.

One bullet I do I'd like for the 44 and I might consider over the XTP if were still shooting one would be the 265gr interlock. I've had quite a bit of experience with their interlock bullets in big bore rifle calibers and have been very impressed.

I was lucky that I was able to watch the 3 I shot with the XTP. The problem is other areas will have the deer gone in one or two bounds.
Take into account, we hunt together and after one of us shoots a deer, we stay put and it could get dark. I don't like the worry if I will find blood.
I went to cast with a good meplat and there has been no lack of a trail anymore.

430man,

I have enjoyed our lighthearted debate. I certainly respect your experience and opinions. Best of luck to you this upcoming season!

And not enough weight, perhaps?

Penetration is not all about weight, frontal area affects penetraion as well

I am well aware of this, but some more weight wouldn't hurt.

More weight is always a help with penetration, but a bullet that drives all the way thru a deer ,doubles in size and stops under the hide on the off side has done what it was made to do.I weighed one from my wifes deer that went from chest to back of ham that lost less than 15 grains of weight, 90 grains of 3fff at 10 yds. I want two holes in every thing I shoot if possible as where I hunt they can be out of sight in a couple of jumps. So far I can't find a cast that will shoot with the xtp ,but I am still working on it when finances allow.