I guess I'm not a newbie to firearms or specifically pistols, but I am REALLY a newbie to handgun hunting with a revolver. I recently purchased a SRH in 44mag, changed trigger return spring, and ordered an UltraDot. Plan on hog hunting in October in Oklahoma.

1. I normally shoot bullseye league (with a 1911) and do OK (300's) with it. Is it normal to have a LONG learning curve with the 44? I seem to be able to hold a nice 3 or 4 shot group, then blow the other 2 or 3. I am trying to really focus on the front sight and trigger squeeze, but groups are about 4-5" at 25 yards, (all unsupported) Not good enough, in my opinion, but again - I'm a newbie to this 44 thing!

2. Regarding first question, I have not purchased 44 dies for my press yet, but will quickly with the cost of ammunition! I noticed that using Fiocchi 240 SJSP I can hold closer to 3" groups unsupported. Win white box as good or better. Cheap Blazer opens up to 5" groups, all 240 sjsp. Is it normal to have such a difference, or am I just still needing a LOT more practice?

3. Is there a huge difference in factory 44 ammo? All mentioned Fiocchi, Win, and Blazer "felt" way different. Blazer was very mild recoil, Fiocchi not bad, one box of Win a little harsher, and one box of Winchester - again, same load - felt like I just slammed a hammer into my palm, sending a a jolt up my arm! Needless to say, that box got put aside, I can't imagine THAT much of a difference.

I have at least 500 rounds downrange so far, but none supported. My Ultradot comes in Wednesday, and I will bench it to see what happens. I guess I just need more range time - and realize that it's not the same as my 1911!

Any and all advice appreciated. At 43, I've learned that I have a lot to learn.

One box you didn't mention is Remington 240 Semi-Jacketed HP. That factory load has shot very well out of my Ruger SBHs. I've never owned a SRH.

The Fiocchi 44 ammo has been horrendous out of all of my guns. Blazer - nope. Win. makes some different loads that vary in power. In the Winchester line for hunting I would probably elect to use the platinum tip or the dual bond.

You may be an accomplished bullseye shooter but you'll need to learn to take those fundamentals and apply it to a harder kicking, heavier gun. If you're having problems with the recoil any optic will only add to your frustration in the short-term. I would have a buddy load some empty chambers and not tell you which ones are live and see if you're getting a flinch with the heavier loads.

Dry fire practice will help your groups immensely and to see what type of accuracy you're getting test the different ammo choices off the bench first.

Gary

Well said. A grip atuned to target loads will not give the consistancy required for loads with authority. Not white knuckled by any means, unless you hang with Whit, but you gotta be firm and consistant. Welcome to the addiction...

Also, concentrating only on the front sight or mainly on the front is not going to work well. You need to pay close attention to both front and back sights equally. I shoot uspsa and bullseye as well and front sights are the name of the game. It really requires and well balanced look at both sights. Also I would practice using a rest until the sight picture and accuracy are obtained then move to offhand shooting. And like Gary said when an optic is thrown in, the frustration levels can go up exponentially.

Hornady and magtech shoot best from my particular super blackhawk. Win, blazer, fiochi, and most other cheaper ammo have left alot to be desired.

I have good success with mag tech as well.

Geo,

One thing I would suggest is separating your accuracy testing and "training" to shoot unsupported. By this I mean do not be afraid of using a good solid bench and technique to test your factory ammo and new handloads. There is no question that if your hunting plans include offhand shooting, then this needs to be practiced, and absolutely your poa/poi will differ from the bench v. offhand, but imho, finding an accurate load needs to be done as a first step, and this usually requires a bench for us mere mortals.

When you understand the mechanical ability of your ammo/reloads/gun combination, then you will have a better idea if your offhand shooting is improving. By the way, I am a long time 1911 user, so revolvers are still a lot of work and frustration for me ;^)

Craig

Where in Oklahoma are you hunting?

Exactly!

Thank you all for the help, sorry for the delay in saying thanks!

You advice has helped. I guess I just need to focus on the basics - that seems to do the trick.

Not to brag or sound like a total idiot, but shooting the 1911 for me came fairly easy. I'm finding out this revolver stuff takes a lot of practice, and patience. I have a whole new respect for handgun hunters now!

I've been doing a lot of offhand shooting, and my groups are improving. I've also noticed that when shooting at objects instead of targets, I'm building a lot more confidence. Tin cans and swinging targets -seem- to me to be easier to hit than similar size bullseye targets. I've also learned that it takes a new grip, and a new stance. My current PD/bullseye grip just doesn't get it, I am used to a modified Weaver stance. Switched to isosceles stance and wrap-around grip has really helped, although it has been hard to remember to "adapt" to...

By the way, hog hunt is at Shiloh Ranch near Ada, Oklahoma in October. This is my first time.

Jay

And a whiole lot more fun.

Welcome to the wonderful world of handgun hunting. all advice above is good. The only thing I would add is be patient. You will get there and after your first hog you will wonder why you just started doing this. It's a blast!!!!

Jay,

I have the same afflication, that being better at ANY other targets than round circles on paper ;^) Luckily I shoot on public land, so I have lots of rocks and pine cones that I work over when I get frustrated with paper. And when I am working on "real" shooting, I usually drag a bunch of steel to my shooting hole. Your not alone.....

Craig

Update.
I have myself set up to load now, loading 250gr Keith bullet on top of 19.7gr. of 2400(lee autodisk) and CCI primers.

Ultradot mounted, best group at 50yds from somewhat of a rest (forearms supported only) is about 8-10". Removed the UltraDot and down to 5-6". Seems like I'm jerking the trigger when the dot is on the target - waiting on it to settle, then jerking. I'm not jerking the trigger with open sights.

Question is, do I practice, practice, then more practice with the Ultradot, or practice, practice, and more practice with open sights?

Next question is an old question with lots of answers, but be honest with me - what should I expect for a newbie group at 50 yards with forearm support? I'm getting really discouraged, and just to make myself feel better, I shot my 1911 at the same target with 3-4" groups. I know it's me, not the gun or load or any other excuse. Is this "good enough" for hog hunting from a stand? Should I take the old trusty lever action instead?

I really LOVE my SRH. Probably my (now) most favorite in the safe. But I'm getting really discouraged at my ability with it...

(Pardon me if I sound like a whiny little baby, but I just can't stand not being accurate!)

You have jumped into the world of heavy kickers and expect to master it overnight,[ain't gonna happen]. .Seasoned shooters and coaches make bad students sometimes. You reload now so back down the load a bit.Take a good rest and concentrate on trigger squeeze and sight alignment.The ultra dot is causing target panic, so you slap at the trigger, concentrate on the dot and have someone else load the gun skipping chambers. Start at a reasonable distance 10 or 20 yds to build confidence, not 50 .You are a coach would you start a new shooter at 50?
Relax, If it ain't working today lay it down, don't just keep reinforcing BAD habits,they are damn hard to break! This is in no way a bashing, just trying to get you to slow down, and get back to basics,do what you already know how to do, just like YOU would start a new shooter.
Welcome to the world of big bore

Jay,

I can tell you that going to a dot is a whole 'nuther world for accuracy. One thing to consider is the axis point for the dot. If you study the left right motion of your gun, you will probably see that with irons, given the amount of front rear separation, a little rotation left and right of the gun seems to move the misalignment of the irons a lesser amount than the dot. The dot could be swinging a greater arc for the same amount of gun movement. This will play heck on the old pea brain when you are really bearing down.

An old archery trick is to try and place the sight dot, high, then low, then left then right then on it then release. Or some folks would try and spin a circle around the target and get smaller and smaller. What is most critical is try to like crazy to see the dot as the shot breaks, as this is the only way to know if you are pushing the gun on the trigger. A dot will really show this up, and mess with your head. It might also be a simple case of changing your finger position on the trigger to get the pull straight back. Or even changing grips to make sure you trigger finger is laying correctly on the trigger, and pulling to the rear.

As to the hunting with it, have you tried sticks? Maybe there is enough room on the stand to sit further back, and place the barrel of the gun on sticks. This would probably change the pivot points of the gun, and perhaps dial you in better. Of course shooting from sticks will not produce the same poi/poi as shooting off hand, but it sounds like you have a reasonably fixed shooting scanario with your hunt, so maybe working with it might help. Maybe place a leather pad on the/a rail and place the barrel on this. Or your wrists? Or a sandbag?

Craig

Before you go beating yourself up, try a jacketed bullet like the XTP or similar. Naked boolits can be a royal PITA.

I have found I shoot better off the bench with my bogpod bipod propped against the front of the bench and resting my wrists on a sandbag. Once I have found an accurate load and am sighted in I don't shoot much more paper. If I can hit a five inch plate at 50 yards I know I can kill big game at that distance. I don't have to shoot a 3 inch group at 50 yards but I want to be able to hit that plate at whatever distance I plan to shoot game every time I pull the trigger. I suggest reading the article on the home page about field shooting positions and experiment to see what works for you. I use my bog pod alot. Even in a tower stand with shooting rail I will take it If I think a shot past 100 yards may be needed. I will still rest my pistol on the shooting rail but will also rest my wrist in the v of the shooting stick. Shooting off hand is great but anything you can do to steady your shot will improve your success. WHn I stalk hogs I will take any shot I can get inside of 25 yards but if I had the choice to shoot 50 yards sitting with my back to a tree forearms on my knees or close the distance to 40 yards and take the shot standing off hand I will take the 50 yd rested shot all day long. Good luck on your hunt and don't give up on it. Be patient take your time and when you feel tired or beaten up take a break or just quit for the day. I personally would stick with the red dot.

Junebug and the rest of you just made a light bulb come on in my thick head. The answer is no, I wouldn't start a new shooter at 50 yards. And yes, I fear bad habits forming...

I'll go back to 25 yards (I shot ok there) and will try to get used to the wobble. It feels like I'm learning to shoot all over again, and I guess I am learning all over again!

Thanks for the advice, I'll try to shoot less rounds - more often, at more appropriate ranges. I guess I just expected to pick up the SRH and punch nothing but 10 rings. I really didn't expect to have to go through a learning process. Now I'm realizing why a lot of guys around here (Indiana) usually only handgun hunt for deer one year and then give it up - I can certainly understand why if they had the same (wrong) expectations that I had...

That said, I'll go try again - with a new (very humbled) attitude.

You are getting some really good advice here.

BTW, WELCOME to HHM and the world of handgun hunting!

Geo I say I don't like to shoot paper. For me it seems the high level of concentration over an extended period conbined with the blast and recoil just isn't fun to me. You coming from a bullseye background may be fine with paper. Just experiment a little and see what works for you. Don't give up it gets easier. Keep it fun.

Well, I found out you are all right (not that I had to, but just so you know).

I did not clean my pistol that evening, but did the next morning. The barrel was full of lead - took me a LONG time and LOTS of scrubbing to get it out.

Tonight I put the ultradot back on, and fired factory ammo. I was too lazy to go out in the pasture to move the target in, and wanted to just fire a few out of curiosity. Factory Winchester 240 JSP all went into a 4" group at 50 yards, and it didn't take but a few shots to sight in. Obviously, the guy I bought the cast bullets from (local shop) either used too soft of lead or didn't expect me to load them that fast!

I will get my lazy butt out tomorrow to move the target in, and get a more steady rest to really get it dialed in, then move back out to 50 later. After really concentrating on keeping the dot "close" to target center, I seem to be able to then focus on trigger control. I am still occasionally flinching, but dry fire is forcing me to stop - muscle memory.

Set out some tin cans - they didn't stand a chance against me at 50 yards. They were dispatched quickly and humanely with no suffering.

Overall, I'm a much happier person tonight...

Next question - redirect me to another forum if necessary - I need load data for Speer 240gr "Deep Curl" FP bullets. Can't find any in my books, and the Speer website has nothing. I only have Alliant 2400 right now to use, but if necessary will buy something else. I'm kind of upset that Speer sells a box of bullets to me and it's not in my Lyman book or on the web - including their own site.

Thanks y'all. Not only did you make me happy, but you probably saved me a lot of money too. Anyone got a bullet puller I can borrow, or do you want to buy about 200 rounds of 250gr Keith bullets over 19.7gr of 2400? Guaranteed to lead up your barrel!!

Geo - congrats! Sounds like you're on the right track...

I'll check my manuals this weekend to see if I have any data on the Speer DCFP bullets.

Sounds like you are a quick learner; good job. Keep working at it and your confidence will build.

Geo,

I load 19-20 gr of 2400 for my FA's & Ruger's behind 240s. I have used that load a lot with Speer bullets. I believe that you have a Ruger. If so, these loads should be no problem for it to handle.

Yes, it's a SRH, 7.5".

Loaded 19.7 of 2400 with the 240gr. deep curls. Taking all of the advise here, and my groups are shrinking rapidly. 4" from a rest at 50 yards, better at 25 yards. I'm now feeling confident - I am told I will be hunting from a stand (I'll make a rest), with shots no farther than 20-25 yards. I still want to work up to being proficient at 100 yards, but for now I'll limit shot distance.

Also spent half the day with a bullet puller, and an old RCBS press and pair of pliers! I was able to reclaim my brass/primers, and have lead to melt into something later (I'm getting the itch to buy a mold now!).

Damn. I'm seeing myself getting hooked on this, and I haven't even had a chance to hunt with it yet!

Forgot to mention - stopped by the shop where I purchased the bullets. The guy told me he intended them to be loaded less than 1000 fps. Now he tells me...

Geo,

I think he may mistaken. The deep Curl bullets are intended to be hunting bullets. In .429 diameter and 240 grain in weight, me thinks that the bullet had to be made to work at 44 mag velocities. There is only a very short list of guns designed to shoot .429 bullets, so unless they were built for the 44 Special, I tend to think you are good to go. If you are shaken by his advise, I would drop an email to Speer pronto. They will have the final word. Dollars to dougnuts you are fine ;^)

Craig

(Last post was reference the cast bullets I bought, not the Speer Deep Curl)

Just letting y'all know - killed a really nice pig last night about sundown. About a 25 yd. shot. Used 19.7 gr. 2400, 240gr Speer Deep Curls, standard CCI primers. Bullet entered left side, took out the spine, and continued somewhere. This pig was probably 140 or so, and a very stout boar. Dropped right where I shot him. I was rather relieved to see him drop instantly after hearing all the horror stories of losing hogs due to bad shots/ammo/etc. Interesting note is blood on entrance wound was about the size of a quarter, exit wound about the size of a quarter, and NO blood on the ground. Sure glad I didn't have to track him!

I was at a ranch that caters to bowhunters, so it was nice to show that a responsible hunter with a handgun was "OK". The ranch owner had problems in the past with handgun "hunters" (meaning those who thought they were hunters).

So now I'm blaming all of you for getting me hooked!!!

Congrats, Sometimes you'll lose a hog with a good shot, good bullet, but 90 percent of the time even when they don't bleed they don't go that far. Nothing builds confidence like taking game. The deep curl bullet is a good one. Never heard anyone say not to run it over 1000 fps.

Eric - Geo was referring to the cast bullets that he had bought in bulk.

Geo - regarding the lack of blood on the ground...with a spine shot, there's very little vasculature as compared to the heart/lungs. That, combined with the lack of movement/activity after the shot means there's not a bunch of blood pumping out. Clearly effective however! Congratulations!

Geo,

Congrats, and a great ending to a bit (or lot) of worry. And double congrats for helping a ranch manager see what a responsible handgun hunter can do. One for you, one for the sport.

Craig

I'm running all of the speers I shoot at well over 1000 although I do prefer the 270 gr in the .44.

The gun shop owner did not say to not run the deep curl over 1000. I had purchased cast lead from him, and he didn't warn me until after I found out about the leading that the lead was too soft to run over 1000 - which is why I bought the deep curls.

He shoots hogs almost on a daily basis - wounded, etc. He uses a Ruger 77/44 loaded with 240gr. XTP's and swears by the XTP. I figure if it works for him (even though it is through a rifle) they should work for me too.

Now I just have to find load data for XTP's for my SRH. I'll post in the reloading forum.

Again - thank you all for the advise. It paid off for me!

http://www.hornady.com/team-hornady/scrapbook/ibex-taken-with-44xtp-james-swidryk

I was looking at the Hornady site concerning the 240 g 44 XTP and look what I found!

Nice ibex J from J!

Wow! I wonder how much powder he used?

I could have had an ibex - one came in just after the lightning storm started on my second night. I was trying to text the ranch manager to see how much it would cost me to shoot when lightning got worse (I was in a tree stand). Decided it was best to get out of the woods!

Found out later it was NOT very expensive. Could have made a 25 yard shot, too. The ibex didn't spook until I was almost at the bottom of the stand!!!

Have to brag a little: