I think the biggest way to help each other is as follows....when we make a kill with our handguns, tell what round, bullet, bullet weight, & powder charge we use. Take pics of entrance & exit wounds & discuss animal reaction & distance animal ran after shot. We need to discuss tissue damage & quality of blood trail. The biggest thing we need to do is to fill the bragging board up with handgun kills! That means get out & hunt with your handguns!!

Yeasir. I agree. Its also a fun way to research

I'M IN!!!!!

Sounds like a plan. I wish our deer season wasn't 5 1/2 months away.

You will see TN Lone Wolf, this & every hunting season separates the handgun hunters from the handgun "talkers". I hope everyone involved in this forum topic & other topics really get out & handgun hunt. In my opinion, taking a doe, coyote, or even a field mouse with your handgun qualifies you as a hunter. Unfortunately, it seems like the same group goes hunting while everybody else sits on the couch. If this inspires you to go handgun hunting.....well.....GREAT! We learn best from each others handgun hunting experiences.

Moose heart that I shot in the 90`s shot with Freedom Arms 454 and FA`s 300gr JFP ammo at 60yds. Looks like reflex water buffs heart is much bigger or is it my old eyes....

That water buff heart was 18" tall and weighed over 20lbs. It was like leather. Very strange to me. I shot twice even though it wasn't needed. Hard to see from that shot but the bullet destroyed the bottom of the aorta and blood was shooting at least 4' from the buff. The guide said he had never seen anything like it. Here you can see the track of the blood on the ground.

Just remember guys lest keep the hunting fun and the data second. I have become so infatuated with numbers before that it started draining the fun out of my hunting. We are all here joined by a common bond. We enjoy hunting with guns that don't have butt stocks. Some like single actions. So do I. Some like double actions. Me too. Some like single shots. I in. Some like autos. I can go there as well. I have been fortunate to kill critters with all of them. If we are careful and observe results that we can share we can still have fun and learn something in the process. reflex264

I am with you on this Reflex. I learn something new every time I make a handgun kill. It doesn't matter if it is a WT doe or a Nilgai. They are all learning experiences. In my "neck of the woods" WT deer are my "willing" test subjects. If they walk in front of me while I'm in the deer stand, I'm "willing" to shoot them. I shoot them, young or old. They all taste good & there is NO shortage of deer in the south.

Yep I have absolutely lost count of handgun killed deer. I still get excited when a fat doe steps into range. reflex264

Thanks

I had to show this to my wife to prove to her that I am not the ONLY one in the world that slows down while driving to look at every single deer. To her, they are "just like seeing another dog". But I never get tired of them. Deer, elk, turkeys, antelope, ANY wildlife causes me to slow down and take a look.

She just doesn't get it???!!!

I would like to thank everyone for keeping this thread civil even though there is clearly some disagreement, which is fine. We don't have to agree all the time. I don't know of another forum where you could have 91 replies and a good bit of disagreement and no one has really gone off the rails. It's a testament to the caliber of folks here.

I have really enjoyed this thread. It has a lot of good information in it(as well as many others). Although I don't have much (any) experience with the big critters, I've learn quiet a bit on here. Now if you want to talk small game.........I've killed a squirrel or two.

I do have plans in the future to hunt some big game and I'll make my decisions on what to/not to use based on what I've learned here.

this is partly my fault. i was hearing the siren call of a 480 srh at a local pusher's store. i also happen to have a friend who has a 480 srh and a few 475 linebaughs who graciously offered the loan of these guns to do some comparisons. i have parts and a donor gun for a 500 linebaugh and was musing on the fact that the 480 srh would be a turnkey gun. i may take a flogging for this, and one test is not a final conclusive solution, but i did not see enough gain over my 45s to justify going to the 480 and am going to the 500 linebaugh. phonebooks do not indicate how an animal will react to being shot by x bullet at y velocity, but do give an idea about wound channel and tissue destruction. i am planning on a progression of several deer to pigs to black bear to water buffalo over the next few years. one reccuring theme i have seen on this thread is that even though we all have differing opinions, there are still a pile of dead critters by handgun and that is the end goal anyway. sorry for a long post, matt.

Yep this group has class. Friendly disagreement is a great learning tool. reflex264

As LABRAT mentioned the .480 I too have heard its call. I will say one thing about the gun. It is super accurate. I shot a one handed group at about 23 yards ( we had a fire going so we had to scoot down hill) that was about 1.5". Then set a 12ga hull up and one handed it at 25 yards. The gun was just that easy to shoot good. One big surprise was the 360gr oregon trail bullet in ruger level .45 Colt loads. From my 4 5/8" gun they clocked 1248fps and if I remember right 1367fps from Matt's 7 1/2" hunter. Both of these out penetrated the .480 and .475. The permanent channel was even a bit larger. Herein is the point where we need input on kills. I will take this into consideration on the questionnaire. reflex264

Bullet and speeds of the 480 & 475. I have never seen any 45 Colt or 454 load out penetrate a 475 420 grain LFN. I mean a true LBT LFN in the 1350 fps + or - range.

I have shot some good size boar with my 475 using JHP bullets and then shot some more boar and a red stag using my 500 and JHP bullets. The difference in the wound channel was plain to see so I understand when you said you did not see enough gain over your 45 to go to the 480 and just go straight to the 500.... top boar is shot with 475...bottom pig is shot with 500jhp...and please don`t anyone tell me the 475 boar had thicker hair. The proof was in the wound channel after we opened them up..

I agree, it happened to me. Unfortunately you can't find two identical test mediums if you try to use critters. And of my testing a different result was found just about every time. Shot two brahman bulls for a friend,(weights were 1906lbs and 2012lbs, not dangerous game or even a hunt,just test medium) same gun, same load, and from measuring with a tape less than a inch difference on impact points, results were way different. I finally decided dead is dead. I try to use the combination that causes this result the quickest. From my testing, shot placement was way more critical than the projectile or speed of said projectile on the eastern white-tails I have used as medium. For those animals shot over the 800lb (mostly domestic and behind a fence) then other factors such as bullet structure and velocity started to come into play more. This just my 2 cent testing and opinion.

Increased velocity and increased wound channel size does not always equate to increased stopping effect.

Whitworth shot a hog with the 416 Remington for a review using the 300 grain TSX at 2900 fps. The bullet destroyed both lungs and the damage was described to me as massive, yet the hog ran and was not located until the next day.

Cottonstalk expressed some valid points above.

That is one of the best benefits to hunting on a ranch or preserve. You get to test bullets on large heavy game without going to Africa or Argentina. That is something that I will probably never be able to afford. I try to use my experiences testing bullets on such game to give those who are able to go on foreign safaris a little insight into what these bullets do on flesh & blood. I know everyone knows this, but an animals' physical composition is the same whether it is in front of or behind a game fence. If I was planning the hunt of a lifetime, such as a Cape Buffalo hunt in Africa, I would certainly go to a game ranch and shoot a Water Buffalo or Bison first. That would give you as close to the "Cape Buff" example as there is, the only difference is that both Bison & Water Buffalo are larger than Cape Buffalo, weight wise. Testing bullets like this is not for everyone. To each his or her own. Even a Domestic Bovie like an Angus Bull can & is dangerous. They are truly not as unpredictable as Cape Buffalo, but ask any farmer or country boy , they will stomp a mud hole in you if you are not careful. Our fellow member Junebug can attest to that. That is why I speak of hunting a Water Buffalo as large dangerous game. When you put a bullet into one, they become "wild" in a hurry.

if increased velocity AND increased wound channel size doesn't equate to an increased stopping effect i guess i shoulda shot my cape buffalo with a 9mm. they don't always put the animal down quicker depending on adrenalin and placement, but over a couple kills it will be seen as a difference. question is, how does a nice 80 caliber hole going through with high velocity equate to a .5" hole at a slower velocity. i think it i'll take the 80 caliber hole when shooting cape buff and i've found the combo to get the requisite penetration. on those buffalo two exit holes matter not.

i've done lots of penetration tests where a monometal large meplat solid from a 454 will outpenetrate hardcasts out of the 50 and 475 calibers, in fact just did one last night.

100%.... Mark, Well said.... My observations of the terminal effect of my 475LB and my 500WE were after a number of different size animals were shot be me and then opened up on the meat rack......

That was one tough pig.....

Just curious trad, if a monometal large meplat solid was used in the 475 and 50 would the results have been the same? just curious

franchise I get the testing part of shooting animal mediums, but in my experience the only critter I have shot wild and behind a fence is a hog. My experience was they were different. The wild hog was leaner and more aggressive and his hide was thicker and hair longer, the behind a pen hog was fat,and while it may have offered more resistance to the bullet due to that fact, it wasn't anywhere near as rangy or aggressive as it's wild counterpart. Now I am not the hog slayer Whit and JFJ is but this is just my 2 cent experience I have had.

Shot placement reguardless of projectile is above all else. Put the right bullet at the right velocity in the wrong spot and you will either have a long tracking job, or a lost animal. Put the wrong bullet at the wrong velocity in the right spot and you may have to trail but more times than not vittles will be on the dinner table.

I am told all the time that old colt velocities aren't as good, but deer fall every year around here to sub 850fps projectiles and they are no less dead than the ones killed at 1500+fps velocities. There maybe more damage done internally but they are both still dead,and on the dinner plate.

Just to clear up the 416 Remington boar kill.......I thought Whit shot that boar with a Hawk bullet & that is why the boar got away...now I am curious. I probably have this and another hunt confused.

My statement was doesn't always and that is my experience that I can cite many examples and at least one picture.
There are certainly extremes to this that you nor I would do. But the fact remains there are no absolutes. I am a firm believer that in revolvers that a larger diameter is an advantage, but not automatic.

Of course that was not equal bullets to equal bullets. Mono metal bullet out penetrate hard cast in my experience.

The instance that I am referring to was a 300 grain TSX at 2900 fps. The hog was recovered the next day. Whit wrote an article about this experience.

10-4.

Indeed.

I shot this deer with a 338 Lapua with a load generating about 5200 FE and he ran.


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I have came to the conclusion over several decades that once a wound is large enough, larger isn't always more decisive or needed. A bullet that has adequate penetration and a large enough wound channel works as good as any in my experience. A bullet that doesn't give enough penetration or a large enough wound channel will not give satisfactory results. To define and adequate wound channel is the debate.

That deer may have ran, but you were in no real danger of losing him. Gotta love pics with intestines.

This is from a 600lbs cow elk. 38 yards quartering away shot. 350gr .458 Hornady flat point started at 2100fps. Exited through that shoulder after leaving a 2" cavern all the way through the chest cavity. Dead right there.

This is the damage a 500WE made on a recent double lung shot red stag from a 325gr Swift over 30.0grs of Lilgun shot from my Freedom Arms 6" revolver. Does anyone have photos of critters shot with handguns???

Damage left by 325gr Swift on pig. Someone said in this topic that revolvers and single shot handguns shooting rifle cartridges are like apples and oranges or something to that effect. So with that said, the damage a straight wall revolver round will do is no where near the damage a high speed rifle round will do. I would really like to see more photos of what handguns do to game because comparing rifle killed game to handgun killed game is also like apples and oranges. I hope all you handgun hunters will understand where I`am coming from.....