So I have been working on a woods load for my Ruger 1911. I found a WFN by Accurate molds that looks perfect and drops out at 230 grains. I am loading 5.0 grains of Bullesye at 1.198 OAL, it ran about 840-850 fps.

Well I wondered what would happen if I bumped it up to 5.1 grains, I loaded up 25 and went to the range. First round had a little stiffer recoil than I anticipated, I looked down at the chrono and read 985 fps! Well that cant be right, so I fire three more 990,978, and 980. Accuracy was great and recoil was just a little stiffer that normal. Still didn't make sense to go from 840 to 980 fps.

When I got home I looked at my scale and I had confused my "tenths" and had loaded 6.0 grains of Bullseye. Everyone can make a mistake guys so double check!

On the other hand I REALLY liked that load! It was very accurate and that is developing some good horsepower! Really how far into the red is that and what would I need to do to be safe firing that load. Brass looked perfect...

5.7 gr is what I see for a max on the Alliant site for 230 gr bullet. I don't know what to say. Many people upgrade their 1911s to 45 super with a stronger recoil spring. Don't want you beating the gun to death. Be careful.

There's the issue of beating the frame up. This can be mitigated by heavy springs etc.

The other issue is having a .45 ACP case blow out. It has happened to me and was not a pleasant experience. Neither the ACP case nor the standard 1911 barrel chamber were designed for high pressures. You need to examine your barrel to see whether it has a fully supported chamber. Some 1911 designs leave part of the case exposed, which is safe at the original pressures, but unsafe with hotter variants. I'm not familiar with the Ruger 1911 barrel and so I can't comment.

If you like the thought of the hotter loads, then there are people on this forum with extensive experience with .45 Super and 460 Rowland who could give really good advice on how to proceed.

My first thought was "It's a Ruger! No biggie!".
That's not a wise thought...

Well it has a 18lb recoil spring which is a little heavy and i replaced the recoil spring with a 23 lb one which is a little heavy. Im not interested in running 500 of these loads as my main load will be 5.1 grains. However if I'm not on the verge of blowing my grip out with a single round i would like to shoot a magazine per year/carry to shoot hogs.

Did you know the whole 'popey thing' was an error in math too? Some guy misplaced a decimal point that showed spinach to have 10 times the iron it did. Yeah, spinach is good for you, but right in line with other dark green leafy veggies.

I made the same mistake you did once. I had just got done running some .44mags, and then for some reason decided to run some more. I set the powder scale at 26 grains. Should have been 20.6. I'm not sure what keyed me in to there error. I only ran a few that way before I found my mistake, but how many explosions do you need that close to your face?

I do love my Vodka/Cranberries in the evening. I'm working on one now. I'll even use my drill press or belt sander if I'm still on my first one. But one sip of the devils juice and I don't touch my guns, chainsaws, table saw, nor reloading bench.
It's not the odds, it is the stakes.

Now this brings me to a pet peeve of mine. There are so many guns out there. You can get guns that will out run your needs if not your desires in most gun stores. I just don't understand folks who load stuff 'hot'. If hot is defined as above spec that is. I load my 9mm's to middle / high range. Same with the .45 acp's and mid powered stuff like that. My mags and Casull's I run at max published loads. What is the sense of running a mild magnum?

It is like the guy who says his S10 pick up can out run yours. Of course, he fails to mention that he pulled his 4.3 v6 and crammed in a Rolls Royce Merlin. At some point that is no longer an s10. To me that point is when it leave stock specs.

If you want a more potent .45acp, get a .460 Rowland. If you need more umpf, get a Desert Eagle or a nice wheelie. I would hate to see someone hurt from my loading over spec.

But that's just me.

DB



Please note: I just re-read this before posting. I used the general 'you' in my post, I was not directing this to any one person here.

Absolutely no offense taken and I error on the same side you do. Presently the remaining loads are marked and set aside.

It is no big deal until you blow the extra rounds out the bottom of the mag.

Not me but I saw it happen at the range.
Blew the grip panels loose from the side of the grip too.

It was a double charged load my guess was just over 8 gr of bullseye over a 230 SWC.

years ago when we were young and dumber (i hope) a buddy of mine ran his colt gold cup HOT. one day it started trowing rounds all over the hill side. took it apart to clean it and it had cracked all the way around the mag well. last i knew he still had that frame nailed above his reloading bench. jmho if ya need bigger and faster get it. dont send a boy to do a mans job. god knows mistakes happen. like smoking while reloading. and they say the tar is bad for ya!? i got lucky on that one smartened up before bang. all we can do is try to avoid them with care

Reloading certainly has the ability to make us all candidates for the Darwin Awards. I've only been reloading a couple two or three years, and I know I've made my mistakes too. Thankfully, I caught them before they caught me.

I agree with Dog. I like running max loads, or near max loads that are published. I have NEVER gone above that. Just don't see the need to. If I have a need, or want, to go over that level, it gives me a perfectly good reason to buy a new gun!

Be careful fellas. I have yet to meet most of you in person, but would like to someday. Just don't want our introductions to take place at the Pearly Gates!

The bullet I am casting for it.





Well these will hit the scrap pile, the 5.1 grain load should land me squarely in the 850-860fps range.

Why can I not get the photo to upload correctly?

Science,

If you do a little searching here, you will find the threads on the 45 Super and 460 Rowland. I shoot both of these in 1911's, quite safely I might add. But, there are more than a few questions about your gun, brass and load that would give me pause.

As mentioned above, case head support is paramount. Along with this is the brass. You can find very mixed information on the web about what brass is dimensionally different within the 45acp design. You have standard, +p, Super and Rowland, all from various makers. I have used +p, Super and Rowland brass to safely achieve 230's at and above the 980 fps (more or less) that you reported. In your case, is your brass new factory, once fired or mixed headstamp range brass of unknown age? The brass has to support the pressure, and the barrel has to support the brass.

I am not really familiar with reloading bullseye, but have a lot of experience with other fast burning (relatively) powders, and generally a slower powder is usually recommended for pushing the proverbial envelope. And most certainly the ladder type reloading approach, where you measure everything along the way is better than jumping into the deep end, as you have done.

A 230 grain bullet in a 1911 running 980 fps is not an unsafe combination, but depending upon your barrel, your brass and the way you arrived at that load would give me pause.

As to the thoughts that the 1911 was not designed for this type of load, well, Colt built a 1911 for these pressures. It is called a 10mm. It's unsafe because no one builds a 45 Super? The Super was trade marked. There is a lot more to the question of why a particular cartridge is not chambered by many makers, and hence deemed safe and mainstream by folks who do not subscribe to going past SAAMI or conventional wisdom. We have Ruger only 45 Colt loads, 45-70 Marlin loads, 45-70 class loads in the AR15 and a host of other beyond SAAMI but published because they have proven to be safe.

How is it we now have published, safe Ruger/TC 45 colt loads? Folks experimented, published results, pushed the buying market and the powder and bullet makers followed suit with data. For folks who feel SAAMI is the bible, never to be deviated from, take a look at the 45+p. There is only one bullet official weight/pressure. The 185 jhp, at 1130 fps and 23K Max. Avg. Pressure. But I can go to the store and buy a 230 +p. Ammo makers decided if the gun and case can take 23k psi, then it does not matter what we load as to bullet. A little logic and experimentation.

Craig

The brass is mixed Federal and Winchester large primer that is once fired for the most part.

The chamber has good case support as near as I can tell.


The end results that I am searching for is a load that will put down the random hog on the lease. To achieve this i found a WFN mold that casts wheel weights at 230 grains and feeds like a champ. I know that 830-850 will suffice but a solid 880-900 would be nice. I am using Bullseye because I have a few pounds, its cheap, and all my loads have been accurate. I chased more velocity with HS-6 once but I wasn't pleased with it at all.

Just so that its known "I wasn't purposefully trying to hot rod here, it was a Pure D accident". My line of work requires me to be very meticulous and I carry that to the loading bench. My primary message was to remind everyone that even though you may have reloaded for many years, STOP, THINK, and CHECK. An accident might be right in front of you.


I do load for 45 colt in my Bisly, using medium Ruger only loads with HS-6; its a hoot.

Science,

Yes, I completely understand why you posted. I am pretty anal in my reloading, and I would be dishonest to say that I have never thrown a bad charge. I have always caught my mistake, and the once or twice it was usually with my beam scale brain farting with the slide, wheel, tenths and tic marks. I tend to triple check things and have caught mine.

If you have the time, the thread below has a lot of interesting information on the 45 Super and hot 45 acp loads. It is about Glocks, and the 1911 cannot be loaded to what they are doing, but it is a great read.

Intersting 45 Super thread

I am jealous. I do not cast, and a 230 WFN would be sweet. I have ended up fiddling with 250/255 class bullets, with the 250 XTP (non-mag) being one of my go to loads. 900 fps is not a great stretch with a 230, but some.

With the 1911, case support at the barrel is the biggie. Same with Glocks. You can beat a 1911 to death if not properly set up, but you can hand grenade one with a case rupture. I think there are some discussions of fast powder in the thread above. I am not going there. I like the powders for the 460 Rowland, as they are slower than bullseye. But more importantly, with something like Longshot, my prefered powder, I have pressure data at acp levels and Rowland levels. A bracket, if you will, to help me sleep better at night.

The other part of the fast powder equation is bullet setback when feeding. It sounds like your's are feeding well, but any bullet setback will raise pressures. The faster the powder, I would imagine the higher spike could be. Once you start going off book, you have to evaluate every single decision carefully. If you can find pressure data for Bullseye, great.

If not, then powder is a critical variable. Non-standard bullet shape means that you may not find any data for the hardness, bearing surface, oal length etc. Bullet becomes a bit of an unknown, as all affect pressure. Standard pressure acp brass being used for higher pressure also becomes a bit of an unknown. I know Starline 45 Super brass can take Super, Super +p, and Rowland pressures. i have used nickel RP +p 45 brass for 230's at 900 fps successfully. I would never go much higher.

HS-6 is one of my favorite powders, for my 45 Colt, 45 Colt "+p" and reduced 454 loads. I have a lot of it, but have never even tried it in 45acp or Super.

Not saying that your combination of parts for the equation would not work, but you may be giving yourself almost no room for error. I know it sucks not being able to go out and buy the things you need these days, and I have found myself contemplating trying to shoehorn what my gut says is the wrong powder for what I am trying to achieve.

Craig

Something similar happened to me once. I was practicing with a 9mm when it suddenly blew pieces and flames out all directions, and there was a heavily damaged brass case partially sticking out of the chamber.





The scary thing about that event was I was shooting factory loads.

Here's how I solved the problem. Carrying a 1911 everyday and having it with me on the north end of the ranch while fixing fences with a potential problem black bear. I switch magazines from hollow points to Double Tap's DT Hunter ammo, this is a 255 SWC hard cast bullet rated at 875 fps out of a 5" barrel. DT has done all the pressure testing, etc. and all I have to do is make sure it functions and hits where I'm aiming, and it does all that very well. I really like it.

TN,

That is a classic case head blow-out. Could have been weak brass, the chamber on the bad side of case head support, or the bullet setting back badly in the case when feeding. Or a combination of some or all of the above.

It does not take a double charge to have this happen. I have had one of these, and it was not much fun.

Craig

Craig

Ive seen it many times with nickel brass that was re-manufactured ammo... Im not going to list the company but I did notice that it only occurred with the nickel brass.....

It would blow out in my glock....I pulled some bullets to weight the charge, none were double charged.... I just ended up shooting that ammo in my ar 9mm

SG--Glad you are OK. l had a similar thing happen to my F I L many years ago shooting reloads in his 44 Ruger SBH..He fired one rd that seemed a bit loud. 0n the net rd the ejector rod housing sheared off and launched itself past my head.. After returning home we pulled a couple of bullets and found he had loaded 18.1gr of Unique instead of 11.8..A FULL 50% overload in powder ALONE..l have no idea what the pressure was..l can pretty much be certain it was way more than ''50%''..