Your sitting on a folding chair overlooking a salmon stream in Alaska. The distance for a clear shot is no more then 40 yards. Out pops an average size brown bear that has no idea your there. Whats your choice of gun and load in that situation??

I'd pull the 500JRH off my hip nice and slow. Put the front post right behind the shoulder. Squuuueeeeeez the trigger, and hit him with a 440gr WFNGC over 29.1gr of H110 right before breaking into my happy dance!

...then I'd go back to fly fishing.

Well, if I can afford to go on a brown bear hunt I can afford a new gun so I'd be packin' the new Ruger 480 Bisley stoked with a heavy slug and a full case of H110. Nice view.

Average size bear.... keep an eye out for his grandpa. .. double hual a babien special slightly up stream mend... follow the swing and wait for the slashing strike of a pissed off sockeye.....

From my current arsenal it would be my SSK Contender in 358JDJ with a 250 grain Hornady Interlock. If its early in the hunt I would probably pass on the shot and wait for an above average size bear. If I was getting a bear gun for the hunt it would probably be a .460 S & W or perhaps a Redhawk 454. In any case I would be sighting with a Bushnell 3200 2-6 scope.

I've already answered, and I stand by what I said. Never even THOUGHT about passing on the shot for a larger animal. I have never passed a legal animal that I have a tag for. Always look forward to a full freezer of meat I can eat rather than racks or rugs. They are a lot of fun to look at though!!!

But that being said, I certainly understand waiting for a large one if it is early in the hunt. If the guide told me not to shoot, I'd have a hard time not doing it, but would trust the guide.

Good on you guys for thinking about that stuff! I didn't even think about having a guide there!

How much time do we have to hunt? On the last day, if it's brown it's down ;-)

Either a.) A 200 to 220 grain Nosler Partition out of my 300 Win Mag Encore backed up by my 460, or b.) A 300 grain XTP-Mag or 360 grain Cast Performance Bullet atop as heavy a charge of H110 as I can safely load in my 460, backed up by four other such rounds in the cylinder.

Most likely choice b if it's definitely no further than 40 yards.

My .480 Super Redhawk with 355 gr hard cast or 12 in Contender .45/70 backed up by my 4 5/8 .45 Colt with 300 gr hard cast. Whether or not I would shoot I can't say, till I am in that spot. I sure would like to have another person there to watch my back though.

At 40 yds you want to break the bear down, hopefully both shoulders if you have enough gun & bullet but for sure break him down & then keep shooting if anything is still wiggling! A big bear that close thats wounded can close the gap very, very fast & then you are shooting at the head if you can see the head for all the splashing water!
The 480 would suit me fine but instead of the 385 gr. HP I normally use I'd switch to a 410 gr. cast solid. If you are hunting Brown Bear you would have to have a guide & he would be well armed, that is unless you were a resident.

Dick

FA .475L; 400 gr. XTP, first up, alternated with 420 gr. WFN, 26 gr. H110, CCI 350's.

If im hunting alaska for brown bear it would be a once in a lifetime hunt as i would probably never shoot another one i would hold out for a big one. Last day hunt it would be my 480 super red hawk 400 grain hc ... and pray to god its not my last hunt.

I feel like keep repeating myself bc i keep using the same thing but id like my 10"454 with 325 gr swift a frames running a nice 1600 fps. That goes for any size bear. That said id feel good with any of my guns with any good load evn down to my 41 mag with ceb 220 gr solids

What I do is try to get closer then shoot him my 44mag loaded with 270 to 320 grain H/C bullet. Get to do it every year heree if you want.

45colt 350gr hc running 1200fps, first shot dead center front shoulders for the breakdown.

Okay, I have to ask about this "breakdown" that you guys are talking about. I don't understand what you are getting at. I've taken two black bears with a bow, and both were shot right behind the shoulder and didn't go more than 30 yards. I used the "typical" broadside shot placement on both bears.

I know we are talking about brown bears here, but why not put a shot in the lungs / heart, and call it good? Why the shot in the shoulders? Does that also take out the lungs?

I'm not arguing with you guys, I just don't understand the idea behind "breaking down" an animal. Seems to me the heart / lung shot breaks them down pretty quick since they die quickly when hit there. Perhaps the shoulder shot is a superior shot than what I normally take for some reason? I'd just like to know why.

Thanks!

Edit-- Could one of you perhaps post a picture of the aim point you are referring to as well? Thanks guys!

rap, The reason for the shoulder shot on brown bear is to anchor him in place so he cannot make into the alder thickets or come at you and tear you up. When I shot my brown bear at an even 50 yards I aimed for the lung area when presented as it was the best shot for me. He started tearing up the ground and biting at the hit and flopped over dead in the water. I was using Cor-Bon`s 360 grain Penatrator load, that I bought for a hippo hunt that never happened, in my FA`s 454... Maybe some of the members who have taken brown bear will add their experience....

475 Linebaugh 355 Grain WFN GC cast bullet,

A lot will depend on the species being hunted, in particular its tenacity and the percentage of anaerobic muscle fibre. Even with the heart/lung area demolished, some species will have enough oxygen in the system to be able to run a fair distance. In close country this often leads to a lost animal. With dangerous game, the shot animal can close the distance and chew you up before it crashes. A high shot through both shoulders limits its ability to escape or attack and allows time for a killer shot if needed. If the shot placement is too high then the spine is likely to be taken out, and if low you're back into the heart/lung area.

Encore in .470 NE or .416 Rem backed up with my .475 FA

Ok thanks guys. Glad you guys didn't take my question as an attack also. I think I will stay with my answer of a heart / lung shot. My 500JRH is open sights, so if I hit slightly high, I have a LOT more room for error with my normal aim point. Obviously the shoulder shot works, but I don't think I'm comfortable with it. Been doing heart / lung shots so long with a bow that it's just instinct to aim there I guess.

Thanks for the explanations.

The reason I said break them down is because you always prepare for the worst. A double lung shot means a dead bear....but a bear is extremely fast, & he can easily live 3-4 seconds, he can cover 40 yds in 3 seconds if he wants to & that is possible so you play it safe. Just think of a Volkswagen coming down a slide at 30 miles an hour & hitting the water, do you think you would be able to see it in the water? Breaking those shoulders puts him down, now you can finish the job & everyone stays safe.
Read Larry Kellys account of a small bear coming right into their cabin & him & his guide shoot it all to pieces with 2 very powerful guns at poing blank range before they kill it. Something like 11 hits at under 10 yds & its trying to eat both of them. Breaking big bones, "breaking them down" keeps them in one spot until you can finish the job.

Dick

I agree that anything that can chew you up or stomp you flat should be anchored (broken down) with a high to center shoulder shot. When I was in South Africa, all of the PHs ' said the center shoulder was the shot for every animal big or small.

I've always shoulder shot deer, or neck shots. I still have yet to shoot one with a revolver, but plan on high shoulder shots for items such as the .480 and 41.

I once shot a deer with a 7mm magnum behind the shoulder and it ran over 100 yards and died in heavy brush. Even with a soft ball size exit hole and no heart, the will to live can be strong.

I am uncertain about shoulder shots with soft cast bullets running slow (700-850 fps). Our deer aren't big and the shot won't be more than 50 yards, but I didn't know if a soft slug would do the job on bone. I figured my 44 special would be a heart/lung puncher.

As for the bear, I'd be so excited I couldn't shoot. I'd just rather take a picture of him!

How do you define a "soft" cast bullet, everyone has a different opinion of what is soft & what is hard when it comes to cast bullets. When Elmer Keith was making his own cast bullets he referred to hard cast but what he was using was actually pretty soft compared to what we are using today. Almost everyone shoots an alloy thats at least as hard as WW's or harder. Its tough to define.
My last cow elk was a very large one, I was using a 41 magnum with a 250 gr. LBT WFN cast slug that was about a 12 BHN, the bullet broke both front shoulders & exited at about 74 yds I think. If I were shooting a large Brown Bear I would probably bump the hardness up to maybe a 15-16 BHN but wouldn't feel the need to go any harder than that & I would for sure try to break both front shoulders. With a bow & arrow it would be an absolute disaster to try & make a shoulder shot on a large bear. Just my opinion.

Dick

Dick, You bring up a good point about softness of the cast bullets used by Elmer Keith. Can`t imagine what type of leading problems they had to deal with. He was never one to use gas checks....

James, the reason Elmer never had to deal with leading was that in his early years there weren't any handguns capable of shooting cast bullets very fast. It wasn't until years later when he finally got his first 44 special that he was able to start getting velocity up to where the cast slugs had to be somewhat harder. I'm sure many of those early cast loads were pretty much pure lead which accounted for many millions of buffalo in black powder rifles & these were driven faster than any handgun could shoot them at the time. I think the original 45 Colt black powder loads were pure lead with a hollow base bullet & running about 900 fps. A cast bullet with a BHN of 12-15 will handle 99% of any handgun shooters needs. When you get up to the really big stuff like you & Darrell's Cape Buffalo then a bullet around 18-22 BHN works best as long as its tough without being brittle, you want it to penetrate but not shatter.

Dick

I have found that all the bone splinters from the bullet passing through the first shoulder do a good job poking holes in lungs.

Wow, learned a bit there. To me, soft would be 10-12 BNH. I figured once a bullet like that struck bone it would mushroom out and penetration would be affected. I don't want the bullet from my 44 Special to zip through a deer and murder 3 oak trees or anything, but I would like to catch both shoulders. Sounds like I don't have much to worry about.

This will be my first year hunting with cast. I'm still running 210 XTP's in the 41 magnum, but have been eyeballing the 250 Cast Performance.

Thank you for the valuable information.

Brenden

SEAK is correct about the bone splinters, they can make a mess.
The 10-12 BHN you mention is what Elmer Keith considered hard at the time, thats why people get so mixed up on bullet hardness. Now days most people lead their barrels because the bullet is too hard. that is, they are shooting a very hard bullet slow & you don't want to do that. Thats when you get gas cutting. If you shoot slow then shoot soft, if you shoot fast then you go up in hardness. Your gun will tell you.
My own personal rule has always been to shoot as soft a bullet as my gun will allow, if its starting to lead I go up in hardness if I don't have the velocity I want. If I have decent velocity & I'm not leading then I don't change anything. But accuracy always has to come before anything else, it has to.

Dick

Probably my .480 with 355 CPB bullets over a stiff charge of H110. It would break the shoulders and leave a large wound channel. It would be surgically accurate at that range.

It would be with my long time favorite, TC Super 16 tapered barrel 45-70. Since a brown bear is on the menu I'd say a 400 grain soft point round would do the trick.

On my hip would be my Ruger SRH in 480.

RT, one thing to remember is that you won't be eating the brown bear. This is strictly a trophy hunt or hunt to control their numbers; brown bears are considered inedible and the AK Dept of Fish & Game doesn't require you to pack out the meat like they do with black bears, moose, and all other big game species. So, in this scenario it would pay you to wait for a bigger one if you have hunting days left.



As others have stated, by shooting through the shoulders you get the lungs, plus take out the running gear so as to hopefully prohibit the bear from reaching the alders.



RT, please don't take this the wrong way either but I don't understand your response? A shoulder shot is a lung shot, plus it helps to break the animal down. I hope that you can see the bullet hole in the shoulder of my brown bear mount in the photo below.


There is another hole in the shoulder about two inches to the left of the one that I am trying to show. After the first shot, the bear began biting at the wound, falling down, rolling around, growling, etc and I kept shooting. He never made it but about 20 yards and was dead in 30 seconds. This was with a shoulder shot.

Hope this helps....

I have had the privilege of hunting brown bears twice with a .500 S&W and I am doubtful if there is a more grand adventure. To witness the speed, power, and grace of these majestic creatures is awe inspiring.












They live in some beautiful country and I would highly suggest embarking on this adventure if you ever get the chance!



to answer the original question....If I ever am fortunate enough to hunt another, it will be with my Freedom Arms 454 Casull shooting 325 grain A-Frames.

Darrell H.

Thanks Darrell. About my question concerning the shoulder shot... I thought the shoulder was to far forward to catch much of the lungs. Thanks for your picture. It certainly helps me with the anatomy and bullet placement. I just have a hard time getting my mind to "switch gears" to something different than bowhunting. I haven't hunted seriously dangerous game, just two black bears. So the dangerous game thing is new to me.

Thanks for the help Darrell! Much appreciated!

I would use my Linebaugh Bisley Conversion in 500L with a 440gr Pearce LFN hardcast. Why? It's the biggest gun I have and I'm too old and fat to run from a wounded bear.

Bigger is definitely better. Especially when the intended target can eat you!

Agreed! Can I share one more photo? This is a photo of a bear taken by another hunter in camp during my 2011 brown bear hunt with Phil Shoemaker. The client's name was Mauricio and he was guided by an awesome guide named Mike. See anything unusual?



Sorry, I just love to talk about brown bear hunting.

An extra tooth??

Hint...look to the left of the client's right shoulder.

WOW!!!!!