Does any one know where I can get a 180ish gr. .357 hunting bullet for my Maximum? I'm burdened to live in California where they are fazing out lead bullets for hunting and the only one I can find is a 140 gr. Barns. I want something heavier but can't seem to find any.
I have found several custom copper rifle bullets that will expand down to about 1600 fps that will work but not "pistol" bullets. Thanks.

abner,

The Barnes philosophy for the X series bullets is to decrease weight and increase velocity, this includes handgun bullets eg. 200 in the 460 S&W, 275 in the 500 S&W. If you can only find the 357/140 XPB they should work for you in the Max. I have used the same bullet in my 357 Bain & Davis' (44 mag necked down to 357) with excellent results on antelope and whitetails.

Doc

SChunter dropped a Texas buck at , I believe, 140 yards with factory 357 mag ammo using the 140 barnes. Saw a ram he took using the same load. Like Doc said above, it should be fine in the 357 max.... Good luck

Abner,

Have no fear - the Barnes 140 gr kills out of proportion to its diminutive weight

I have had good success on deer, hogs, and mouflon alike with factory loadings, and the increased velocity out of the Max should increase the terminal "benefits".

I killed a mature doe with my GP 100 last season using the Barnes factory load with that bullet. She did not take a step.

The problem with heavier bullets is that copper is lighter than lead for a given volume, which results in a larger bullet. In other words a 180 gr copper bullet is significantly longer than a 180 gr. conventional jacketed bullet. In some cases the longer copper bullets may interfere with chamber length, cylinder length, pressures due to increased bearing surface etc.. Another issue is expansion. Copper bullets require more velocity for reliable expansion. Loading a lighter weight copper bullet is one way to increase the velocity within acceptable pressure limits.

Sawfish (and others) have some good points, but some details need clarification. Probably more then you want to know, but...
1) Bullet expansion with today's technology is based on design fabrication and build geometry in addition to material properties. Cases in point. The black tipped TAC-TX bullet by barnes for the 300 blackout is all copper and designed to (and tested to) function (expand to 2x original diameter or 0.6 inches) down to ~1300 or 1400 fps giving it a ~300+ yard range with the rifle
Other bullets are designed to expand at the typical velocity they will be used at. Hornady makes 2 version of the 30 cal flex tip 140 gn rifle bullet. One for the 30-30 (lower expansion velocity) and one for a 30 cal marlin express (higher expansion velocity which is a bit faster.
When you are working up a load, call the manufacturer and find out what the minimum expansion velocity is and make sure your bullet is traveling at least that fast at the ranges you want to shoot.
2) because they are longer, use the reloading information supplied by the manufacture. Most of the new bullets have grooves cut in the bearing surface to reduce the bearing surface and chamber pressure to more "normal" ranges for given velocities and loads.
3) One of the unique features of copper bullets is that they typically retain all or nearly all their weight (don't shed a large fraction of their weight in small lead particles in the tissue). I don't shoot typical pistol and haven't seen much info on retained weight in pistol bullets other then that posted here (most examples shown here tend to retain most or all their weight, i assume this is because of lower initial energy), but rifle bullets can lose a huge fraction of their lead core in the animal depending on the bullet design (see the download report here for some examples http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/hunting/lead/index.html) One of the results of all this is that most copper bullets are expected to pass through since they don't shed their energy in explosive destruction of the bullets core on impact.

I have not hunted or shot the Barnes bullet for the 357 or any other handgun, but expect it would stay intact and turn into a 0.7" mass of metal passing entirely through the animal if used as directed. If you can, use a chronograph to determine velocity and then calculate max functional range and stay within for best bullet performance.

as always, placement, placement, placement, much like location in real estate.

Thanks guys for the replies. I really wanted more weight for the max but I will most likely try some Barns 140's. I'm quessing they will pass through anything I would shoot with the 180's. I'm thinking deer, blackbear, and hogs.

abner,

What gun are you shooting the .357max out of? I have used the 140 leverevolution out of a 10" .357 mag. tc contender with great accuracy and a complete pass thru on broadside shot deer. Only one deer with that load. 40-50 yard shot. You might be able to use bullets for .35 Remington?

MOHunter - It's a 14" T/C. I'm getting +/- 1850 fps. with my beloved 180 gr XTP's. I will continue to use them where I can, but here in Calif. I won't be able to for long. My main concern is, will the Barns 140 be enough bullet for black bear in regards to penetration. I know I will get the expansion. I have a e-mail into Barns asking them their ideas. I'm sure the bullet will work wonderfully, I'm just not big on changing something that has worked so good in the past.

abner - I didn't read your original post that well! I missed the CA info, I don't have any meaningful input on how it would work on a bear. I have not shot a bear yet. I was just adding what experience I had with that bullet. Best of luck!

Thanks MO - I received an e-mail from Barns. They assure me it will work just fine even at the higher velocity.