so, on a hunt this weekend and just giving some food for thought. i think getting out information on results, HONESTLY, is something that can help us be successful and also not make handgun hunting look bad to ph's, guides, etc.

so here's a comparison of the performance of a hornady xtp mag 300 gr which hit the shoulder of a red deer. then the a frame recovered on the offside shoulder of an asiatic water buffalo.
two xtps were shot into the shoulder and neither made it through the chest cavity and the mangled one didn't make it into the chest cavity, hit the shoulder bone just above the elbow by about 4". evidently bullet turned, opened up poorly and was found sideways in the back of the on side shoulder up against the rib cage. i'll post the pics of the a frame and the xtp next to each other and then i will post the 2nd xtp found against the ribs on the offside of the chest cavity.

interesting..... post more results.... This is real world bullet testing......would have expected better results from the XTP Mag bullet

What was the MV?

The MV for the xtp mag was 1200 fps or so. The a frame
Was 1540. Thats what concerned me. Bullet was not pushed and failed when it encountered bone. Im trying to find a pic of the other bullet and it just disintegrated and a lil piece of
Lead was all that was found. Prolly 30 grains worth

I have to say that I found the performance of the XTP to be disheartening and underwhelming. I saw enough that I really would hesitate to use them on anything really large. That said, the A-frame was pretty much spectacular!

It's hard to compare evenly unless both bullets had the same exact velocity and both encountered the exact same bone. Bullets do weird funny things all the time.What killed the red stag? Did the xtp's kill him or did you have to shoot him again with something else? I have recovered 250 gr xtp's fired from a muzzleloader at 15 yds that travel from chest to ham on deer that look like your swift bullet, perfect mushroom. Mz with 90 gr fff black powder was well above your swift bullets velocity. Xtp's have worked for me so far. I do not have the debt of experence that you and others here have on big game as all I have killed is whitetail. xtp's have worked well on them so far. This should be an interesting topic.

That's good stuff Trademark! I'm like Junebug-- I don't have a ton of experience with different bullets, but the things I have shot with the xtp mag 300 grain bullets have all traveled a very short distance, if at all. They were very accurate out of my 460 S&W, and always did the job. I'm wondering if this is one of those cases where "any bullet can fail at any time". But then again, Whitworth obviously has had, or seen, more than just one failure with them.

I've never used the A Frame, but have never heard anything bad about them. Aren't they designed for different velocities though?

This is very interesting to me as I am in the process of researching bullets to handload in my 45 acp for everyday carry. Thanks for starting this thread!

The stag was killed with an aframe out of my gun shot by the shooter. I was cideo taping. If u asked me about xtps after my first 10 or so kills i would habe told u they were excellent. The next five not so much! Sad thing is i shoot about 2 to 3 thousand rounds of factory ammo per year and if i had bought those winchesters with fa bullet instead of xtps and a few others did as well perhaps they would be available. I have over 2000 xtps on my shelf to reload and about 1000 rds of factory hornady ammo in my ammo box and i now relegate them for deer duty and practice ammo. When the trophy fee is big and on the line its barnes or aframes all the way.


Im not saying this to start a pissing match. I am just passing on information so someone else doesnt have a bad outcome. Its much like cast bullets. They are not all built the same. Theres really good ones and really marginal ones. Would be nice to know which is which before ya lose an animal imho!?!?

I appreciate the stories of them working well and i have my own as well but imho theyve been reliable about 2/3's of the time.

That swift went thru bigger bone at a higher velocity. Not sure what else needs to be said on that other than my cousin used one on the front of the left shoulder on his watusi and it penetrated to somewhere in the guts and it went down in less than 20 yards. Ive never had an xtp survive that bone at that angle, though i have tried.

Plain and simple, the Swift A Frames are just better bullets! They are bonded and very well made.....shoot some of the Woodleigh 400 gr 500 S&W bullets and let me know what you think....they are heads and tails above XTP's too

Well i know if they work in those cannons u shoot they must be very high quality! Where do u get yours?

This is the red deer and the FA 83 (loaded with 325 grain Swift A-frames) that pretty much saved the day.

Here are four recovered Woodleigh 400gr .50 caliber JFP bullets I removed from a nilgi I shot with my FA`s 500WE. The average expansion and weight for the four bullets were 0.806" and 397.4grs. What was surprising was that the recommended impact velocity listed by Woodleigh was 1500 - 2000 fps (500 S&W velocity) while my handload was running these bullets between 1100 to 1200 fps.. Never expected them to expand as much as they did with those recommended impact velocities...and this from a JFP bullet...

Recovered .50 cal. A-frame...original weight was 325grs...recovered weight was 300grs....they work

Based on the Information you provided the XTP was driven slow. I have found they need good velocity to get a good mushroom and they drive deep when driven at higher velocities. I wonder what the A Frame would looked like if it the same bone at the same speed as the XTP ?

It's crazy how bullets act under certain conditions. Every shot is an adventure unto itself.

What's alarming is that these bullets came unglued at such low velocity. I thought the mags were tougher than that.

Yeah. I gotta find that one pic of the other xtp. It was the exact opposite, just completely annhilated itself at the same velocity and nearly the same shot placement

James, are those woodleigh's bonded?

Is that 300xtp a .430 or .452? Just curious, as I've thought about trying the 300xtp in .430. I've always used the 240xtp .430 and the 250xtp in .452 with great results.

I've since moved to hard cast bullets made by Cast Performance out of my revolvers. I've REALLY liked those. But as for jacketed stuff, I don't think I'll be using the xtp's anymore based of what you guys are saying. They never did me wrong, and were crazy accurate, but if that many of you have had that many issues with them, I believe I'll find a different jacketed bullet to use, should the need arise to use them again. For now, I'll stay with the Cast Performance bullets.

Love me some XTP bullets.

158gr = .357 Mag
180gr = .357 Mag / .35 Remington
180gr = 10mm Auto (not used on game yet)
240gr = .44 Mag / .430 SJS
250gr = .45 Colt / .454 Casull / .460 SW

Deer sized game, they work like a champ so far.

The Woodleighs are bonded. Nilgai are notorious for being hell on bullets. I get them from Midway or Huntingtons

I like the 400 gr XTP in my 475/350 Mag, but so far the 300 gr version out of the 44 Mag has not impressed me at all.

I put in for a Nilgai hunt this year. Haven't decided on the gun yet. Gotta get drawn first.

Go big and heavy for a big Blue Bull

For those of you not that fond of the XTP/XTP-Mag for large game, what about using them on something deer sized?

I have never ever had a bit of a problem with deer and using xtps. I would never use them on elk or oryx. Deer they seem to do well.

Trademark, Yes the Woodleigh`s are bonded and we all know that nilgi are tough critters but I just never expected a JFP bullet with a listed impact velocity of 1500 to 2000 fps to expand as much as they did at 1100+fps MV. Some other members who are also experienced with the 500WE expressed surprise at how much they expanded at such low velocity.....But then again, how can a company such as Woodleigh do anything wrong.....

I stopped using .454 XTPs years ago when I started recovering them whitetails. If a whitetail can stop it I'm sure not using on bigger stuff.
Cast Performance and AFrames seem the way to go. Xs in .475 and .500 do very well, too.

Trademark,

What is the caliber you're referring to? ^^^

It was a .45 Colt, but he used Mag XTPs. I have a picture of one or two of the XTPs in question and will post them up as soon as I can upload them to my computer.

Thanks

I have shot 240Gr XTP's out of my 44 mag at red stag exclusively for the past 20 years. All I have recovered were perfect mushrooms and many hit bone on the entry side. those that hit big bone at exit were mushrooms, but a little dented.

I did however in a previous post mention about how i thought the 240 gr XTP's driven at 1350 were a little hard for whitetails. I think they are ideal for big game but too hard for mid size critters.

So I took to experimenting and I have a fresh batch of 231 grain XTP's I will fire from my 44 mag and hopefully report with good result in a week or so. 231 grains? Yes. I drilled the hollow points a little deeper and wider (.100" deep and 3/16" wide). Velocity difference and impact did not change and I think the bigger cavity will lead to more reliable expansion on smaller game. We will see how they hold up, but i have good faith.

I want to point out though that none of the 30+ bullets i recovered from stags ever suffered jacket separation.

My .02 is that the XTP is too hard for whitetail, but it does the job. I just saw a lot more smackdown on stags with the same load than i did with whitetail, and I have yet to recover a bullet from one. Did they fail? by no means, but i think i want something softer for the thinskins.

A-Frame: I think they are a great bullet but again, for whitetail it might bee too much bullet.

On a separate note, firing shots into dead animals has always resulted in worse penetration from same projectile than on live game. I guess the hard ground behind it has some effect...

SnT

we put them up for testing in an upright position which does compress and make them wider.

Here is what is left of one of the 300 grain XTPs next to an unfired round.

and.............that xtp was fired into a live animal. just fyi. i used to love xtp's but now i find it more of a crap shoot. bullets change and manufacturing changes. my favorite maker of cast bullets evidently changed some things and are waaaaaaaaay to soft. this weekend same manufacturer had a few issues on a couple of animals. that above xtp is absolutely unacceptable.

Send them all to me!!!!!

yours eyes are melted, i can't send them.

Ha!

I use The Force.

Then surely a light saber would be a more effective tool than an XTP....😄