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 Re: Load Testing
[Re: jamesfromjersey]
#190286
03/10/2018 5:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
The large caliber laws of Africa were made for humane kills on African big game and not for the safety of hunters making a poor caliber choice... The PH does all the worrying...forgot to add LOL... They were also created at a time when the best bullets we?re cup and core and generally of a poor quality. True premium bullets like the Barnes TSX has made calibers that in the past were considered inadequate into viable alternatives. Yet the laws of most of those countries related to minimum calibers remain unchanged.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Whitworth]
#190287
03/10/2018 6:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715
jamesfromjersey
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715 |
Life member-NRA-SCI
Member-HHI #2900-HHASA #067
Colt-Ruger-Freedom Arms-and S&W Collector Assoc.s
"I have more guns then I need but not as many as I want" "Handgun hunters HAVE to be good"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: jamesfromjersey]
#190288
03/10/2018 6:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715
jamesfromjersey
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715 |
Whit, Do you have an idea of what bullet type you will use on your upcoming safari???
Looked at your video and see your using the Punch... sorry bout that.... 
Last edited by jamesfromjersey; 03/10/2018 10:16 PM.
Life member-NRA-SCI
Member-HHI #2900-HHASA #067
Colt-Ruger-Freedom Arms-and S&W Collector Assoc.s
"I have more guns then I need but not as many as I want" "Handgun hunters HAVE to be good"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: tradmark]
#190294
03/11/2018 5:29 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212
bscott
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212 |
Everything under the sun but lod testing. This thread has been officially hijacked!
"THEY FALL LIKE DEAD WEIGHT!"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: bscott]
#190295
03/11/2018 12:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
Everything under the sun but lod testing. This thread has been officially hijacked! Completely off the rails...... :-) Hey I wasn?t the one to drag Razor Dobbs into the discussion! LOL!
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Whitworth]
#190296
03/11/2018 12:53 PM
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,821
45MAN
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,821 |
BSCOTT: YOU NEVER KNOW WHERE A TOPIC WILL GO, IT IS A BS SESSION AMONG PISTOLEROS, BUT THEY ARE RARELY BORING.
"ADAPT OR DIE". I USE ALL CAPS, NOT BECAUSE I AM YELLING, BUT BECAUSE IT IS AN OLD HABIT FROM MY ARMY DAYS, PLUS IT IS EASIER TO TYPE AND READ.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: 45MAN]
#190297
03/11/2018 1:07 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
BSCOTT: YOU NEVER KNOW WHERE A TOPIC WILL GO, IT IS A BS SESSION AMONG PISTOLEROS, BUT THEY ARE RARELY BORING. You?ve got that right!
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Whitworth]
#190298
03/11/2018 1:53 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,861
Franchise
Distinguished Expert
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Distinguished Expert
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,861 |
Understood bscott 😜 Moral of my original statement was that Doc is the original "bullet tester" and has no monetary reason for giving his opinion, unlike some of the sh*t you'll see or read. He only bases his opinion on using bullets on game animals and definitely not from shooting phone books 😂😂😂 or paper 😉. His opinions today are what they were last year and any time before. If it honestly worked then, it'll work now, and it always will....basically, the worst test media is dense paper....test on game animals yourself.... and send Doc a PM. He will steer you in the right direction
The Eyes are Useless, When The Mind Is Blind
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: bscott]
#190299
03/11/2018 2:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715
jamesfromjersey
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715 |
Everything under the sun but lod testing. This thread has been officially hijacked! as long as it stays civil its ok....
Life member-NRA-SCI
Member-HHI #2900-HHASA #067
Colt-Ruger-Freedom Arms-and S&W Collector Assoc.s
"I have more guns then I need but not as many as I want" "Handgun hunters HAVE to be good"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: jamesfromjersey]
#190301
03/11/2018 3:08 PM
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 189
spinsail
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 189 |
Probably doesn't hurt that Doc, being a doctor, is essentially a scientist.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: spinsail]
#190302
03/11/2018 3:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
Probably doesn't hurt that Doc, being a doctor, is essentially a scientist. As is tradmark. We developed the Bovine Bash specifically to test bullets on what amounts to the toughest of animal flesh (obviously excluding elephant, rhino and hippo). I can think of no more credible test medium. It ain?t cheap, but the data collected is invaluable.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Franchise]
#190303
03/11/2018 3:16 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020
tradmark
Shooting Expert
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Shooting Expert
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020 |
Understood bscott 😜 Moral of my original statement was that Doc is the original "bullet tester" and has no monetary reason for giving his opinion, unlike some of the sh*t you'll see or read. He only bases his opinion on using bullets on game animals and definitely not from shooting phone books 😂😂😂 or paper 😉. His opinions today are what they were last year and any time before. If it honestly worked then, it'll work now, and it always will....basically, the worst test media is dense paper....test on game animals yourself.... and send Doc a PM. He will steer you in the right direction Thats why all we test on big animals. Ala the bovine bash was created. Then side that lived paper goes nuts.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: tradmark]
#190304
03/11/2018 3:20 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020
tradmark
Shooting Expert
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Shooting Expert
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020 |
I also wouldnt mind simtest or any consistent media. Paper isnt nor has it ever been.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: bscott]
#190305
03/11/2018 3:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715
jamesfromjersey
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715 |
This summer I plan to do some load testing for Bullet expansion vs. Velocity. I am trying to muster up some telephone books (wet them). At what distance do you all normally place them at? 25 yds or 50 yds? Hey bcott... what type and brand of bullets do you want to test?? The reason I ask is they may have already been tested by one of the members and their results could save you time and money...
Life member-NRA-SCI
Member-HHI #2900-HHASA #067
Colt-Ruger-Freedom Arms-and S&W Collector Assoc.s
"I have more guns then I need but not as many as I want" "Handgun hunters HAVE to be good"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: tradmark]
#190306
03/11/2018 3:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 366
JDK
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 366 |
I didn't realize we had two doctors among us. Can we set up a forum for nagging medical questions we're to cheap to see a doctor about?!
Seriously though,because of the special nature of our hobby, we have special issues. We use the same bullets over extreme velocity spreads, which brings the discussion back to BScott's question. When I first got my .357 Max. Barrel, I ordered 140 gr. XTP's for speed, and added a box of 180's since it didn't add much cost. As I researched loads, I discovered the 180 had more speed at 100 yards anyway. I never used the 140's, but I'm curious if they would have even held up to the speed anyway. It seems like XTP's were the current edge then for handgun hunting.
John
But for the grace of God, there, I go.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: JDK]
#190309
03/11/2018 5:38 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020
tradmark
Shooting Expert
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Shooting Expert
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020 |
180 aframe for any 357 running hard will stand up to anything u throw at em!
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: jamesfromjersey]
#190312
03/11/2018 6:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212
bscott
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212 |
Hornady XPT 158 FNP and 140 xpt fnp
"THEY FALL LIKE DEAD WEIGHT!"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: JDK]
#190316
03/11/2018 10:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
I didn't realize we had two doctors among us. Can we set up a forum for nagging medical questions we're to cheap to see a doctor about?!
Seriously though,because of the special nature of our hobby, we have special issues. We use the same bullets over extreme velocity spreads, which brings the discussion back to BScott's question. When I first got my .357 Max. Barrel, I ordered 140 gr. XTP's for speed, and added a box of 180's since it didn't add much cost. As I researched loads, I discovered the 180 had more speed at 100 yards anyway. I never used the 140's, but I'm curious if they would have even held up to the speed anyway. It seems like XTP's were the current edge then for handgun hunting. For your consideration, last year's Bovine Bash..... http://www.handgunhunt.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/183501/page/9#Post183501
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Whitworth]
#190318
03/11/2018 11:12 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 366
JDK
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 366 |
Whit, that was very informative, especially the info about HC lead bullets. Looks like a blast. Thanks for the link!
John
But for the grace of God, there, I go.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: bscott]
#190321
03/12/2018 12:49 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715
jamesfromjersey
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,715 |
Hornady XPT 158 FNP and 140 xpt fnp The only XTP I hunted with was their 180gr. and that was shot at pretty HV from a Freedom Arms model 83... I bought the 158gr. FP on recommendation from a mid-west handgun hunter who used them with much success and whose weapon of choice was also the m-83 and I know he loaded them at 1700+fps, but I never got the chance to use them. There is a post on Shooters Bench about this bullet`s use on game you might read.. Sorry I could not be of more help, however, I`am sure some of the members have used these bullet weight`s in their 357 revolvers...What gun are you using??
Life member-NRA-SCI
Member-HHI #2900-HHASA #067
Colt-Ruger-Freedom Arms-and S&W Collector Assoc.s
"I have more guns then I need but not as many as I want" "Handgun hunters HAVE to be good"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: jamesfromjersey]
#190363
03/13/2018 9:23 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212
bscott
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 212 |
Model 83 Freedom Arms Revolver.357
"THEY FALL LIKE DEAD WEIGHT!"
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: tradmark]
#190368
03/13/2018 4:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,155
Gregg Richter
Distinguished Expert
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Distinguished Expert
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,155 |
I think its fun to experiment and i also think that itd be interesting if the african countries were to revisit the caliber minimums with some more modern bullets in the mix. Mark, Yes it would be interesting and they'd probably find some good reasons to allow smaller calibers USING THE CORRECT BULLET. Now having said that, I do not think that it would be a good idea to change the existing laws regarding minimum caliber. BECAUSE there will always be the ignorant or un-educated "hunter" that is recoil conscious or too cheap to buy a bigger rifle that will happily grab his smaller caliber rifle and go after the dangerous five if it were legal. And have no idea about what bullet to use. Sound familiar? 
At least for now the "minimum caliber" restriction requires a nice big bore size that can somewhat?? compensate for bullet quality. Plus most loadings for those big bores use decent bullets anyway.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Gregg Richter]
#190369
03/13/2018 4:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836
Whitworth
Shootist
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Shootist
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,836 |
I think its fun to experiment and i also think that itd be interesting if the african countries were to revisit the caliber minimums with some more modern bullets in the mix. Mark, Yes it would be interesting and they'd probably find some good reasons to allow smaller calibers USING THE CORRECT BULLET. Now having said that, I do not think that it would be a good idea to change the existing laws regarding minimum caliber. BECAUSE there will always be the ignorant or un-educated "hunter" that is recoil conscious or too cheap to buy a bigger rifle that will happily grab his smaller caliber rifle and go after the dangerous five if it were legal. And have no idea about what bullet to use. Sound familiar?
At least for now the "minimum caliber" restriction requires a nice big bore size that can somewhat?? compensate for bullet quality. Plus most loadings for those big bores use decent bullets anyway. That cuts both ways, Gregg. There are guys that over-power their capabilities who can't shoot the rifles they bring because they are scared of them. Also, the incorrect bullet in a big caliber isn't good either. Recall the failures that were synonymous with Weatherbys because the lousy cup and core bullets were matched with much higher velocities than other "safari grade" calibers. Unfortunately, the bullet is never the factor even though in my humble opinion it is the most important factor bar none. Being able to shoot is up to the individual.
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Re: Load Testing
[Re: Whitworth]
#190410
03/14/2018 6:11 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020
tradmark
Shooting Expert
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Shooting Expert
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,020 |
Good thing that even the most basic rube can shoot a 375hh with a touch of motivation.
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