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Strange 454 velocity findings #202720 10/19/2019 10:47 AM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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I've just started working with a 7.5" FA 83 and I'm not getting the velocities I was expecting. I'm using wc820 Wich is all I used in my BFR with stellar results. In that gun I was shooting a 335gr hcgc at 1600-1700 fps and thats the only bullet I ever used. I came across a deal on a bunch of 300gr Aframes and wanted to used them in the FA but the velocity is very uninspiring so far. At 27.5gr I am 1350fps on the Chrono and I ran out of room crimping at the top of the groove. I have some loaded now with 28.5gr crimped in the bottom of the groove but I'm not expecting that grain of powder to increase velocity over 100fps. I certainly thought driving these 300's to 1600fps would be easy to do but apparently I was mistaken. Does anyone else happen to be shooting a 300gr jacketed bullet with wc820?

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202724 10/19/2019 12:00 PM
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Whitworth Offline
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Do you have any H110/296?


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Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Whitworth] #202726 10/19/2019 3:04 PM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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I don't, but supposedly wc820 is the pulldown equivalent. I just don't understand why it made such better velocity with a heavier lead bullet than it is with the aframe.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202727 10/19/2019 3:15 PM
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cherokeetracker Offline
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w/c820 is the equivalent of AA#9 Virtualy the same powder.
You need to switch to H110 with the Aframes and you will get the velocity.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: cherokeetracker] #202813 10/21/2019 11:34 PM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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28.5 grains in my 6" gun gave me 1560fps avg with 20fps es and 8fps sd. I was shaking like a dog $hitting a peach seed but still managed a 6" group at 140yds off of a hay bale. I know the gun and I are capable of much better but it's definitely minute of deer!

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202820 10/22/2019 12:36 AM
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tradmark Offline
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I believe my 300 gr swift load is over 30grains of powder. I will check

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202821 10/22/2019 1:06 AM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
I believe my 300 gr swift load is over 30grains of powder. I will check


Do you happen to know what your velocity is? I don't think there is any way I can get 30 grains in there with the 300 swift. The freedom arms cylinder is SHORT! It's the only thing I don't like about these guns. My BFR allowed quite a bit more case capacity with the longer cylinder.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202827 10/22/2019 1:28 AM
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Breaking 1700 fos in. 7.5? fa83.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202828 10/22/2019 1:29 AM
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The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202830 10/22/2019 1:54 AM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

What are the other advantages as you see them?

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202837 10/22/2019 3:11 AM
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So i think some of the underwhelming velocity if that powder is in any way similiar to h110 is due to the fact the starting load is 29.9 grains, max is 32.2. I get a higher velocity with a little less powder due to a few little tricks, but i break 1650 fps in my load data at just over 31 gr of powder. Theres a few things to consider when comparing bullets and loading velocities. Material matters on bore sealing. Two is the base to crimp groove length. Velocity is all about pressure and powder burn. Its not uncommon for a heavier bullet to run faster with less powder than a lighter bullet with more powder.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202849 10/22/2019 2:57 PM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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I understand burns rates and the effects of pressure on velocity. There is just now way to get anymore powder in the case as it's highly compressed at 28.5 grains. I am also at Max length for my cylinder so no more room to be had there. I'm happy with 1600fps as that's what I was shooting for in the beginning and I should gain a little in the 7 1/2" gun.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202851 10/22/2019 4:00 PM
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Whitworth Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Willicd76
 Originally Posted By: tradmark
The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

What are the other advantages as you see them?


Transfer bar system allowing for safe carry with a round under the hammer is one. The free-wheeling pawl is another I'm quite fond of. As mentioned before, the longer cylinder has its distinct advantage.


Max Prasac

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BIG IRON: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6aXjMH5C30

Gun Digest TV's Modern Shooter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGo-KMpXPpA&t=7s

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Whitworth] #202852 10/22/2019 4:10 PM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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 Originally Posted By: Whitworth
 Originally Posted By: Willicd76
 Originally Posted By: tradmark
The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

What are the other advantages as you see them?


Transfer bar system allowing for safe carry with a round under the hammer is one. The free-wheeling pawl is another I'm quite fond of. As mentioned before, the longer cylinder has its distinct advantage.


I'd like to try another one in 475 this time...

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202862 10/22/2019 5:25 PM
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tradmark Offline
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Id just try h110 then.

Last edited by tradmark; 10/22/2019 5:25 PM.
Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202972 10/29/2019 3:06 AM
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 Originally Posted By: Willicd76
 Originally Posted By: tradmark
The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

What are the other advantages as you see them?




Sorry. Didnt see this post for some reason earlier. The advantages are a free wheeling pawl, slightly longer cylinder, better grip in the bisley imho and slightly more weight, also stronger. Oh yeah, price.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: tradmark] #202984 10/29/2019 8:49 PM
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Willicd76 Offline OP
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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
 Originally Posted By: Willicd76
 Originally Posted By: tradmark
The bfr has numerous advantages for sure

What are the other advantages as you see them?


I would definitely agree with the cylinder length and probably the free wheeling pawl. The grip is subjective as not everyone likes the same thing as is the weight. I prefer a lighter gun. I also find the comment about strength very interesting. How did you
come to this conclusion? I think everyone will agree that cheaper is better if the quality is there!

Sorry. Didnt see this post for some reason earlier. The advantages are a free wheeling pawl, slightly longer cylinder, better grip in the bisley imho and slightly more weight, also stronger. Oh yeah, price.

Re: Strange 454 velocity findings [Re: Willicd76] #202995 10/30/2019 5:10 AM
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Its stronger due to the same steel but more of it in key areas. I talked to jack huntington about this. He remarked he hadnt yet been able to really really damage a bfr with the same load that had dusted a freedom arms.


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