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Hornady Handgun Hunter #204092 12/09/2019 2:15 PM
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BBwheelgunner Offline OP
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I just came across this about two weeks ago. Pretty cool they are coming out with their own "handgun hunting" specific bullet and ammo line.

I really like the concept of the bullets design, but only achieving 200grs for thier 454 casull and 460 Smith bullets gives me some doubts. especially when Barnes was able to get atleast 250grs out of their XPB for the 454. I haven't seen a listed velocity yet,but in my mind it will have to be pretty high to get the performance out of THAT light of a bullet

https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/handgun-hunter#!/


"If you are going to go through all the trouble to put a hole in something, why not make it a big one?"
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BBwheelgunner] #204093 12/09/2019 2:49 PM
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Curious to see how they work on tissue


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Ernie] #204099 12/09/2019 9:40 PM
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I KINDA THINK THAT IN THE QUEST FOR "FASTEST" WHEN S&W INTRODUCED THE 460 GOING WITH A 200gr BULLET WAS A MISTAKE AND A GROSS UNDERUSE OF THE CARTRIDGE. YOU CAN GET 2,300fps WITH HEAVIER AND BETTER BULLETS. HORNADY GOING WITH 200 GRAINERS IN THE 454 AND 460 IS JUST MORE BS.

Last edited by 45MAN; 12/10/2019 12:35 AM.

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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: 45MAN] #204105 12/10/2019 12:03 PM
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Even in the 44 magnum I was thinking the 200 grain bullet was on the light side. I saw these on the MidwayUSA site, but not yet available. Hornady states that they are suitable for elk and bear.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: ruger4570] #204106 12/10/2019 12:33 PM
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I could see the 200 being useful for smaller, thin skinned animals like whitetails, antelope, and varmints. That's about it.


The meat won't fry if the lead don't fly.
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Randy M] #204107 12/10/2019 1:12 PM
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I've used their 325 grain FTX in my .45-70 lever. Super accurate but complete blow through on deer with little to no expansion. Will be curious to see how these perform.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jcp161] #204111 12/10/2019 3:09 PM
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Look interesting... I should see if they need a spokesman to hawk them here
\:o


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jamesfromjersey] #204113 12/10/2019 4:03 PM
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But that's the advantage of copper/copper alloy bullets. You get same results as lead, but with lighter wght. And the increased velocity makes up for the energy loss of the lighter bullet. I would be interested in there test results of the new bullets on big game animals. And if they haven't tested them real life I would not buy them yet. I've used 210gr Speer Gold Dots in my 44 Mags and have had excellent performance on deer. The only bullet I've recovered was on a mature doe hit frnt of left hind and angled through to opposing frnt shoulder. Bullet found just under the hide. Perfect mushroom. And she didn't go far. Fifty yrds. Most of my shots are broadside and the 210gr Gold Dots blow right through.


Thank You.
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: RJon] #204116 12/10/2019 5:21 PM
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If one could get them as a reloading component, I might try them in my 44 special on deer.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: wheelguns] #204120 12/10/2019 5:27 PM
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When you research them, they are very long for weight and caliber...every bit as long as a 300 gr 44 bullet.


The Eyes are Useless, When The Mind Is Blind
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jamesfromjersey] #204138 12/11/2019 2:00 AM
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 Originally Posted By: jamesfromjersey
Look interesting... I should see if they need a spokesman to hawk them here
\:o


Hey I like that Idea James!


"If you are going to go through all the trouble to put a hole in something, why not make it a big one?"
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BBwheelgunner] #204139 12/11/2019 2:03 AM
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I can see exactly what they were getting at in designing them, and as I said before, realy like the idea/ design.

I was just suprised at how light they were. like Wheelguns said, I hope they make them available as components. I think I would mess around with them

Last edited by BBwheelgunner; 12/11/2019 2:04 AM.

"If you are going to go through all the trouble to put a hole in something, why not make it a big one?"
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BBwheelgunner] #204155 12/11/2019 6:22 PM
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I agree with reloading them... Did not care for the CEB HP`s performance on a large boar but they were accurate as heck.. Its only fair to give them as try as there being marketed to us.. If anything it should be interesting..


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jamesfromjersey] #204196 12/12/2019 8:40 PM
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I'll wait for someone to try them and show us how they work on animals. I may get a wild hair and try some of the .357 Mag stuff when it is available.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: 45MAN] #204199 12/13/2019 12:36 AM
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Here is the new Hornady 200 gr Monoflex, 200 gr XTP, and 300 gr XTP....there is a reason the new bullet is 200 gr's.....if it was heavier, there would be NO room in the case for powder.....


The Eyes are Useless, When The Mind Is Blind
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Franchise] #204200 12/13/2019 1:38 AM
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I?d play with them as components.


"To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Zee] #204204 12/13/2019 12:18 PM
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I WAS COMPARING THE POINTY HP BARNES 45 CALIBER 200gr XPB TO HORNADY's NEW 200gr FPHP 45 CALIBER BULLET, BOTH ARE MADE OF COPPER AND BOTH ARE LIGHT FOR LENGTH. I FOUND THE CORBON 460 LOAD WITH THE BARNES TO BE A GOOD KILLER BUT THEY DID NOT SEEM TO IMPART ANY SMACK/WHACK EFFECT UPON IMPACT. LOOKS LIKE HORNADY IS TRYING TO IMPROVE UPON THE BARNES WITH A BIGGER HP AND AN EXPANDER MATERIAL IN THE HP SO AS TO GET MORE EXPANSION SOONER. THIS MAY RESULT IN MORE SMACK/WHACK UPON IMPACT, WHICH, ON DEER, IMHO, WOULD BE A VERY GOOD THING. I GOT PLENTY OF CORBON AMMO ON HAND WITH THE 200gr BARNES, AND I DO NOT USE MY 460 MUCH ANYMORE, SO I MAY NOT GET ANY OF THIS HORNADY STUFF, BUT LOOKING FORWARD TO REPORTS ON IT.

THE 200 HORNADY IN A 454 FILLS A NICHE THAT DOESN'T EXIST IN MY LIFE. IT IS VERY HARD TO PRESSURE UP LIGHT BULLETS IN THESE LONGER STRAIGHT WALLED REVOLVER CARTRIDGES WITH TRADITIONAL "MAGNUM" POWDERS.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: 45MAN] #204216 12/13/2019 5:05 PM
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who will be the first??
\:o


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jamesfromjersey] #204221 12/13/2019 10:19 PM
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No desire for factory handgun hunting ammo.


"To Hell with efficiency, it's performance we want!" - Elmer Keith
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Zee] #204234 12/14/2019 8:32 PM
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They'll probably release them as components in 2020. It'd be nice to be able to experiment with the OAL. Wonder if they'll fit in a 460 chamber when seated out to the lower groove?

X2 on what 45MAN said. Those 200 grain XPB's will kill, but not quickly.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Zee] #204237 12/14/2019 10:42 PM
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 Originally Posted By: Zee
No desire for factory handgun hunting ammo.



Yep me too


If it jams force it! If it breaks it needed replacing anyway.
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: H2OBUG] #204249 12/15/2019 1:19 PM
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IF YOU COULD LOAD THEM LONG IN A SINGLE SHOT YOU MIGHT COULD GET A LOT OF MV AND MAYBE FANTASTIC PERFORMANCE ON GAME, I FIGURE SOMEONE ON THIS FORUM MAY JUST DO IT.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: 45MAN] #204254 12/15/2019 6:34 PM
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It's been slow here as far as deer movement goes, but it typically picks back up after Christmas. If I can get my hands on some, I might try the factory loads out before season ends.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Chance Weldon] #204258 12/15/2019 7:41 PM
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Hope you can find them and get a shot... Good luck...


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: jamesfromjersey] #204305 12/17/2019 2:21 AM
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If I could get just the bullets I'd try em, but just to old to start buying anything already loaded. Besides, my encore pistol and Katahdin seem to be very well fed with the Swift 300 grain A-Frame.

I just can't wrap my head around using 1/3rd of what I got. At the range I take game at, I don't need more speed, and I can't imagine quicker expansion or penetration than I am getting now.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Franchise] #204930 01/09/2020 4:31 AM
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Those are long for weight


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: nomosendero] #205009 01/12/2020 3:43 PM
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I will try them as components when they become available,I have no choice.With the exception of Badlands Precision Bullets(they only make rifle bullets)I would never even consider copper bullets.They're hard to load,they're finicky, they lose velocity fast and they're expensive-sometimes double the cost of real bullets!Just my $.02

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205011 01/12/2020 6:45 PM
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 Originally Posted By: BIZZMO
I will try them as components when they become available,I have no choice.With the exception of Badlands Precision Bullets(they only make rifle bullets)I would never even consider copper bullets.They're hard to load,they're finicky, they lose velocity fast and they're expensive-sometimes double the cost of real bullets!Just my $.02


I haven?t found copper bullets to be finicky at all. The load development I performed for the CEB bullets I used a few years ago, was remarkably simple and the accuracy second to none. They cost more, definitely, but they are a game changer as far as terminal performance is concerned. The XPBs are really good bullets as well.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Whitworth] #205013 01/12/2020 11:15 PM
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ok I guess I just expect everything to perform like like the deep curls and f xtp's do in my .41 magnum,that's all.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205014 01/12/2020 11:19 PM
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 Originally Posted By: BIZZMO
ok I guess I just expect everything to perform like like the deep curls and f xtp's do in my .41 magnum,that's all.


Which copper bullets have you tried?


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Whitworth] #205015 01/12/2020 11:34 PM
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Barnes xpb and ceb's and lehighs in handguns, barnes tsx,ttsx,hornady gmx, nosler e-tip,ceb mth,hammer hunters and badlands bulldozers in rifles

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205017 01/13/2020 12:43 AM
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So pretty much everything. You?re not getting good accuracy out of them? What powder did you use with the CEBs if you don?t mind me asking?


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: Whitworth] #205019 01/13/2020 1:17 AM
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I'm getting good accuracy out of the CEB's using power pistol like you said.I got poor accuracy out of the barnes at 100yds using H110, enforcer and power pistol. accuracy was ok at 50 yds but that's not what I'm looking for.I'm using a labradar chrono and I have found in the handguns velocity drops a lot with the copper bullets at 100 yds as compared with the lead bullets.I don"t know if that has anything to do with the 100yd accuracy,just an observation.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205058 01/14/2020 2:28 PM
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interesting.

I know every firearm is a little different, but man my old Browning A-Bolt 7mm Rem mag loves factory Barnes VORtx 160gr TSXs. I have shot 1/2" groups at over a hundred yards off bags with it.

My FA83 454 has shot the XPBs pretty well too, maybe not as accurate as the 265 Swifts I have used, but still definitely minute of whitetail.

I even loaded some XPBs for my 45 colt that I am anxious to try at the range. we'll see how they work soon hopefully.

That stinks you have been having so many issues.


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Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205060 01/14/2020 2:39 PM
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 Originally Posted By: BIZZMO
I have found in the handguns velocity drops a lot with the copper bullets at 100 yds as compared with the lead bullets.


Do you have any numbers (MVs, 100y velocities, BCs and specific bullets model #s) you can share on this?

Did the lead bullets you compared to have identical BCs? Did you compare to what ballistic calculators would suggest for the copper bullets?

I'm using an optical chronograph and haven't been willing to set it up that far down range so any information/confirmation of factory BCs would be appreciated.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BBwheelgunner] #205061 01/14/2020 2:46 PM
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Well maybe it's because I have a negative attitude about non-lead to start with because we HAVE to use them.I also want to practice with exactly the same ammo that I hunt with and every round I fire with this stuff I can feel it grabbing at my wallet.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205067 01/14/2020 5:31 PM
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I can understand both feelings. I don't like being told what do do, nor do I like spending more money than I think I should.

I made a personal choice to switched to copper or steel for all my hunting that puts meat on the table after reading the MN DNR report on lead contamination and seeing the X-ray images they took of sheep and deer that they used in the study. Lead was often widely dispersed through the carcass and difficult to predict where it would be. https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/hunting/ammo/lead.html for the study home page with links to a online presentation.

For me with a young child eating mostly venison at home, the potential lead exposure wasn't worth it. Low levels of lead don't really effect adults, but it really messes with the brains of young kids, both before they are born and while they grow.

To lighten the load on my pocket book, I've taken the approach of working up a similar load with a lead bullet and using that for the majority of range time over the non-hunting season and then switching over to copper bullets in the ~month or so before hunting starts. I've found the switch to be quite easy when using optics and I can simply dial in a new POI for the copper rounds. I imagine open sights would be a bit more difficult.

Good luck in finding a load that works for you. Let us know how it works out.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: karl] #205071 01/14/2020 6:15 PM
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karl-cutting edge does not give their bc for handgun raptors so these are the numbers I know without digging too far.this is loads that I will and have used hunting. first is the .41 magnum 210 grain deep curl going 1580 mv, at 100yds it is still going 1250 fps I use this load hunting!next is .454 casull 240 grain C.E.B. raptor going 1620 mv,at 100yds it is going 1190 fps at 100yds, accuracy is 2'' and under at 100yds,I plan on using this load hunting here in the golden state.I'm hoping the power pistol doesn't act up on me when the weather gets up around 100 degrees because our deer season starts the second week of august.

Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: BIZZMO] #205073 01/14/2020 6:46 PM
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Thanks for the details. I'll find the BCs and run them through a calculator tonight and post the results.

Are you talking about the flat based raptors with the black polymer inset in the hollow point? SKU #FB 452 250 Cu RAPTOR

I called and like their technical spec PDF suggests, they don't have any numbers for that bullet. Tami suggested it would be very low and likely around 0.200

Last edited by karl; 01/14/2020 7:00 PM.
Re: Hornady Handgun Hunter [Re: karl] #205074 01/14/2020 6:56 PM
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Thanks karl,I use a labradar and it gives you six velocity readings that you can set from 0-100yds.

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