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44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? #73889 08/26/2010 2:52 AM
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H2OBUG Offline OP
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I have several 44's some scoped with 2x scopes and others open sight only. After our shoot in NC an few weeks back I now feel very comfortable with a 200 yard shot with my scoped 44 in the right situation--I feel like I could put 6 bullets in a 8" pie plate at that distance pretty much every time from a good rest. With Gary's recent 90+ yard open sight shot(much beyond my open sight comfort range) although I have made one shot that far-(keep in mind one data point is not a trend) I am looking at my 44's and 45's a bit more closely. I have always limited myself to 50yds with the open sight 44's (75 with the 8 3/8 " mod 29) and about 100 with the 2x scoped guns.-- much of the reason for this was I had the SSP's for the longer hunting situations-- however now I am reconsidering the use of the scoped wheel guns up to 200 yds--with one of the key factors being understanding bullet drop past 100 yds & a good rest being critical. I think one of the key items for me being able to shoot well at 200 yds with my 44 was picking a very small spot to shoot at and understanding how much the bullet will drop at that distance. Another key factor for these situations will be a range finder-- if you have to guess at the distance the 44 may not be the best option because at 200 because +/- 25 means a lot. Just looking for a gut check here--is this foolish or do I need to look at this as the next level for the wheel gun.


If it jams force it! If it breaks it needed replacing anyway.
Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: H2OBUG] #73890 08/26/2010 3:33 AM
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First of all, the gun needs to be accurate enough with the load you're shooting to be viable at whatever distance you're shooting. I have found that drop really isn't a huge concern with a .44 Mag at hunting velocities out to 100 yards. Much beyond that and things start to get tricky and you had better know within a few yards, how far your target is. With open sights I find the sight picture is the critical part and for that reason I like a hold on the belly line on game animals. With that hold I can see the entire animal and it's much easier to distinguish where the shoulder is vs. when taking a dead-on hold. Invariably when I'm trying to take a dead-on hold I tend to shoot over the animal. I learned what works best for me by shooting a lot of squirrels with an open sighted 22 revolver. Shooting off-hand I'm comfortable out to 50 - 60 yards and shooting a little farther with a good rest. Part of what goes into the decision to shoot is often how well you can see the target. On that pig, I had a very good sight picture because he was pretty dark in some light green grass so it was very easy to tell where the pig was.


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Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: Gary] #73891 08/26/2010 4:01 AM
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All three of my scoped 44's will do 6 shots in sub 4" at 100 yds one will do sub 3" the 45 is sub 3" too. That is with the 2X my guess is if I bumped the scope that might get a little better but I like the compact simple design of the 2X--The idea of sight picture is a must-- that is part of what I love about the scope--there is not near as much to line up--the other point is you can use the deltas in the crosshairs for range points.-- I understand that this is taking things to the edge--but I am thankful for the feedback


If it jams force it! If it breaks it needed replacing anyway.
Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: H2OBUG] #73896 08/26/2010 12:33 PM
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After shooting IHMSA for years, 200 METERS is nothing for a .44 but that involved adjusting the sights and all distances were known. I have shot open sights to beyond 400 yards and once in a while to 500 meters (547 yards.)
Scopes and red dots can't be adjusted for the long ranges. With my 45-70 BFR with an Ultra Dot, I have to aim at a tree branch about 26 feet high to clang steel at 500 meters.
To hunt past about 100 yards with any revolver is folly but nothing prevents a guy from shooting really far for fun. It always involves a good spotter and walking shots into the target.
I sight my revolvers at 75 yards, then measure drop at 200 yards for fun.
I made a new boolit for the .44 and made a 200 yard drop test. The boolit dropped 35". It is a heavy boolit at 330 gr, I don't remember drop with a lighter boolit.
The .475 with a 420 gr boolit drops 18" and the 45-70 drops 16".
I used a red dot because I hunt with them.
This was my .44 drop test.
The RD 265 gr boolit in the .44 is a good long range one. It will hold 3/4" at 50 yards and 1-1/4" at 100. I was shooting this can at 100 and was nicking the rail so I aimed at the top of the can for the last shot and almost centered it.

Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: 430man] #73904 08/26/2010 2:55 PM
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With my old Scoped Redhawk, I would have taken a 150yrd shot at a deer if I had a good enough rest. I never did shoot one that far before I traded it, but practiced enough at that distance to be very confident I could hit the lungs of a deer at that distance. I wouldn't try it without a range finder though.

If you can do it, I say go for it.

Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: H2OBUG] #73909 08/26/2010 3:57 PM
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guitarpicva Offline
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Marshall Stanton has some data which you may have already seen here:

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_notes/index.htm

Near the bottom is some factory vs. 1100 fps handloads and their ballistics. Pretty consistent across a lot of loads.

EDIT: Sorry, I spoke too soon. His data only goes up to 100 yds.

Last edited by guitarpicva; 08/26/2010 3:59 PM.

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Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: guitarpicva] #73912 08/26/2010 6:15 PM
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johnwilliams Offline
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The .44 mag. can shoot flat enough out to 150 with a scope, good rest and proper bullet,past that and like Gary said you have to know the exact yardage and drop of your load.


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Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: johnwilliams] #73937 08/27/2010 4:41 AM
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The other thing for long range shooting is you have to know your bullet will stabilize out that far. I have a 425gr WFNPB that shoots wonderfully tiny groups at 25 yard but will not hold 18" at 100 yards as it is destabilizing in a hurry. The point is just because a load shoots well at 100 yards does not mean it will shoot well at 200, 300 or so on, you have to test it at all ranges. Also just because some ballistic calculator says your bullet is zeroed at x range then at 150 yards it will drop XX amount. You have to know what it will do not guess by putting the trigger time in proving your loads. Plus you have to know what the sight picture needs to be for good hits at different ranges. A buddy did a lot of shooting with his 9" FA 454, he shoots a 300gr bullet at 1550fps and sights in dead on at 100 yards with it. On a 8" gong he learned with his gun sighted as such a 50 yard shot required him to hold at the base of the gong for good hits and at 150 yards he had to hold just so the crosshairs were just over the top of the same gong. He killed a elk at 88 yards and a great 11 point Whitetail that fall at 165 yards with the gun and load.

I would also say that you have to have the right conditions to try long shots on game. Is there snow down to track a wounded animal if you screw up? Is there a rifle backing you up? What is the wind doing? What is the game animal? I would not hesitate to try a 200 yard shot with iron sighted revolver on a prairie dog or coyote but I would never try it on a deer that was not wounded.

Long range is the ultimate test of a handgunner, but with practice, good ammo, a good gun, it is very possible to be proficient at it but shooting at deer at 175 yards is not the time to be learning. A good 10" or 12" gong is a wonderful teacher, take your gun and what you carry hunting and shoot from field positions from all sorts of distances until you are 100% confident you can make the shot at a distance before you try it on game. Don't walk to what you think is a certain distance, randomly pick a spot, stop, range the target and shoot. Move around and shoot again, it is a seriously humbling experience when you can ring a gong at 100 yards at will but at 88 or 117 yards you cant!

Go shoot and learn it is a lot of fun though...

Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: Fowler] #74160 09/02/2010 4:28 AM
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johnnyG Offline
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I shoot open sights with my 44, just my opinion but i think scopes belong on rifles not revolvers. I feel pretty comfortable shooting at 75yds, i shoot free hand only in standing and sitting positions. This is about as far a shot that i will get where I hunt, mostly thick timber and brush. If i have to shoot farther than that i'll take out the scoped '06.

Johnny


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Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: johnnyG] #74199 09/03/2010 5:07 AM
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runngun Offline
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 Originally Posted By: johnnyG
I shoot open sights with my 44, just my opinion but i think scopes belong on rifles not revolvers. I feel pretty comfortable shooting at 75yds, i shoot free hand only in standing and sitting positions. This is about as far a shot that i will get where I hunt, mostly thick timber and brush. If i have to shoot farther than that i'll take out the scoped '06.

Johnny



With many of todays revolvers you cheat yourself tom some extent wiothout a scope. But each has their opinion. (esp the 460 S&W, et all)

Why go from a iron site revolver to a scoped 30-06 rifle? There are lots of in between handguns that would work andd give you that a added challenge and you could still be a handgun hunter.

Re: 44 Mag Wheel Guns--What is a long shot? [Re: runngun] #74202 09/03/2010 11:29 AM
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Whitworth Offline
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I hunted with an 8 3/8-inch .460 last year, and with a revolver like that, you are wasting lots of its potential without a scope. Like idling along at 5 mph in a Ferrari. I have never been a big fan of scopes on handguns, but some, like the .460 XVR are begging for it.

There are other alternatives like red-dot sights -- they don't magnify at all, just offer an alternative to iron sights. Cheating? I don't think so, you still have to hold steady to make your shot.

JMHO.


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