First the roll pin. The one in the open rear sight on a Blackhawk. Anyone ever have issues with it sliding out under recoil? I seem to have to push it back in after every cylinder's worth of shooting. How would you fix it...some blue loctite??

The Bisley (.44 mag) is driving me nuts. I can't seem to make heads or tails on how to keep it on the paper even at 25 yds. It's very frustrating. I was shooting lower powered cast 240's yesterday. First cylinder spanned 3, 8.5" x 11" targets that weren't touching at 25 yds. With the shooting stick, I was able to tighten things up a bit, but totally unsatisfactory for hunting. I am obviously doing something terribly wrong.

Quiz me to see if we can narrow it down, won't you?

On a split roll pin sometimes you can spread the ends a little then drive it back in,locktite wouldn't hurt either.check the cylender throats for proper size , make sure the barrel is clean ,no lead buildup.Sounds like a grip issue ,They can be picky about how you hold them,consistency is every thing, pressure of grip ,how hard you hold it ,hand placement,trigger control.The Bisley eats my knuckle so I have custom grips.Have someone load it for you, (it never hurts even if you are experienced) .I know its a basic list but when all else fails go back to the basics.

pic,

An easy fix for the sight pin is to put a very slight bend in the center of the pin. It will keep tension on the pin so it doesn't walk out.

Like junebug says, check the cylinder throats, plug gauges are the easiest to that with. Then make sure the cast bullets are 0.001" or so larger, ie. 0.430" throats, 0.431" bullet diameter. My Bisley shoots well with cast bullets sized 0.430", the chamber throats are 0.429"

Doc

Guitar,

I have a bisley but never had any roll pin issues but the guys who answered before me I think have the right idea but be careful bending anything or deforming it. You want it to go back in! Perhaps you might try a light dab of epoxy? Just a thought.
On the accuracy thing, try from a bench and take with you to the range at least three different types of ammo (if you don't know what the throat sizes are etc) and try slow and deliberate shooting. I don;t know what you know or don;t so if I offend you, I swear I didn't mean it! Use slow and sleady pressure on the trigger with a suprise let off when it goes BANG with your sight picture never wavering and NO flinch. It will hit where you're aiming with something along the line. Good luck!

I take NO offence. I have read posts from you guys for months now, and obviously, something isn't sinking in, so treat me like the newbie that I am, please!

On the roll pin, I'll try LocTite first, then a slight bend. You know that was really distracting at the range also.

I think my first order of business will be to load up some ammo with 2400 or Unique with my 240 gr. (.430) XTP's. I was using some HSM ammo, and I won't be using that for hunting, so I need to get my hunting load dialed in. I just figured I had it on hand and I could expect to at LEAST stay on an 8" target at 25 yds. It's very discouraging when that doesn't happen.

The good news is, my wife loves to go to the range with me, so I can spend a bunch of Sunday afternoons perfecting this animal. Bear in mind also that I am shooting with open sights at this point. I didn't want the temptation to "go long" with optics just yet, until I can consistently control the beast.

Keep it coming folks! I need all the help I can get.

It's a solid pin. As I say, I think I'll try the LocTite next time out. I have some in my hunting/range bag.

Basic I am, and back to even more basic I will go!

Thanks Bug.

The Bisley grip IS harder to get the same feel with but not that bad, maybe an inch difference in 50 yard groups.
I suspect you need much more practice with a revolver plus a lot of dry firing. From the sound of your shooting I tend to blame you first.
It is rare for any of my friends that come to shoot, to do good with a revolver. If I think about it, there are only three!
I have worked with a lot of them to no avail. I tried everything from loading their guns with missing shots to threats with a billy club. Seems to be a mental block with recoil and the movement of the gun because it can't be held still. Anyone that can hold a revolver still off hand is DEAD!

You'll get no arguments from me 430man. I blame me first also. I did catch myself flinching, and I also (idiot) was shooting with one hand from the shooting stick (habit from shooting my carry pistol). I know I did a LOT of things wrong. I have dedicated myself to taming this animal...either that or one of you guys will get a fair deal on an almost new Bisley and I'll switch to a single-shot.

I'll start the dry fire practice up again tonight and work it every day until the next range run. I have to hit it hard and fast. They close our local (outdoor) range for the Winter and I can't use my woods because people hunt around them and the deer travel right next to my normal target shooting spot (which is where my stand will be!)

Been archery hunting and got one 6 point but the huge doe are always behind my tree so I snookered them today. I put up another stand right behind my other one. I now need a walkway from stand to stand!

Can't hunt tonight, storms coming in and it is too hot.
But don't give up on the Ruger, it really does shoot.
Now for the deer, they are not too bothered by shooting. I have had too many walk past when I was shooting and had a herd bed by my 200 yard bench while I was shooting from 100. Seen far too many deer at ranges while 100 guys were shooting.

A good attitude is the proper first step .If you want something you will do what it takes to get it. Dont get frustrated, most if not all of us have been where you are.If your wife likes to go with you, have her watch your form ,see that you do things the same way every time. Its easier for someone else to see or faults than for us to .You need total concentration on your sights and trigger for the 4 to 6 seconds it takes to break the shot.Thats about all most people can stand before there minds start to drift.If the shot dosen't break in that time reset and start over. This is just basic stuff you probally already know,but sometimes I need a reminder to. Keep at it and it will come.

Are your shots mostly going low, or are they all over the place? If your shooting low,like completely off the target or at the bottom then its a good bet that your anticipating the shot and driving the barrel down when you pull the trigger. If your shots are going wide to the left or right, depending if your right or left handed use a bit more thumb pressure in your grip. This will bring you back towards the center. Are you totaly confused yet, this is much easier to show someone than to type it. My range instructor taught me this at corrections academy and it 100% works. Keep at it you'l get it.

guitarpicva, sending you a PM.

I replied!

Not giving up. Now it's just gotten me mad

so I will make it work.

True about the deer not caring much about the shooting. Last season my hunting buddy was in a stand not far from mine. Three does and a button buck strolled up a saddle and he lined up two of them with buckshot and dropped them both with one shot. The other two stood there gawking at the whole thing, so he shot a third one also (he had nuisance doe tags). Number four doe ran up the hill right under my stand. I lined up the ML on her noggin' and "click---puff", my ML didn't touch off. My breech plug flash hole was clogged up. If I had had my equipment ready to go, we would have spent the whole rest of the day skinning and de-boning! As it was, one of the first two was only stunned and ran off. He never found her. We had the other two in the cooler by 10:30 am. Hated losing an animal like that, but she likely got taken in the neighboring hunt club later that morning.

I had the same problem with the 44 spl. and the sight retaining pin. Pull the pin about half way out and give a couple light taps with a nylon gunsmiths hammer. It's very easy to bend... Mine hasn't moved since. I also mentioned this in the American Hunter article on the 44 spl.

Anyone have any tips on grip angle or how high or low to get on the grip? Do you line up the barrel with your forearm and "get around" on the grip until they are lined up? Ya'll do this in your sleep and probably don't even think about it any more.

My dry fire practice seems awfully steady to me, but the proof will be on the target.

I like to get as high on the grip as is practical,with the barrel and grip makeing a straight line up my forearm. Recoil comes nearly straight back that way for me with just a little torque to the left side. A good trigger is a must ,it dosent have to be light 2 1/2 to3 # is good ,but it needs to be clean ,no take up with a clean break. Had to get the gun in my hand to see how I held it . Don't get a death grip but apply a [consistent] firm pressure.If you get frustrated lay it down and do something else for a minute or so,no good comes from trying to force it. p.s. have you tried makeing any grips yet?
They can be more frustrateing than learning to shoot.

The grip you described makes sense to me, and seems to be natural as well. I actually find myself having to come down on the grip slightly because the web of my hand is actually on top of the hammer spur (which would be a rather nasty feeling after a shot!).

No grip building yet. I have been buried with work. I just got a tree stand up on our property next to the plant on Sunday! (We went on Sunday because there is no hunting on Sunday in VA, so we wouldn't be disturbing anyone or get shot at.)

Thankfully, I have a farm I can hunt any time I want to about an hour away. This weekend, I am going up to some friend's property in Northern VA Friday and Saturday. Seems they are crawling with deer and would like them thinned out. I promised to help!

It's still ML season here, so I won't be able to carry the Bisley until Nov. 13 (and until I can actually shoot the darned thing properly).

The Bisely will lose this battle to my will power eventually. I got a One Ragged Hole rear site to try. I will also paint the front blade tip. I spend way too much time diddling with sight picture because of the difficulty of seeing them. My carry pistol has trained me to look for the white dot. I find myself hunting for the front blade way more than I should.

On the hog leg, I do not like a high grip. My little finger will be under the grip with factory wood panels. I don't remember what I did with the Bisley because I could never tame it so I sold it.
Pachmeyer grips are best for me on the SBH and BFR's.
The gun should NEVER "roll" in the hand, hold it very tight so it raises your arms. A high grip will promote gun movement in the hand.
Grip angle IS important. Take the S&W 29, it is grip sensitive. I shot 1/2 groups at 50 meters with all I owned but if I put the gun down to change a target and then picked it up again, the next 1/2" group could be 10" from the first. I feel the Bisley is somewhere in between.
The old hog leg is still the most forgiving and when shooting IHMSA I would change my hold because target angles were always changing. I never missed a target. With the S&W I would center the first five and miss the next five because I had to ground the gun while setters put the targets back up. It was how I picked the gun up. I sold them all because as accurate as they were, I could not tame them.
Some like the Bisley because they say it has less recoil feel but they beat my middle knuckle fierce! My groups are never as good with them either. I can have blood flying and not change how I shoot so I blame grip angle.
Do your own testing because it is personal depending on your hands and strength. If the gun shoots to a different place when you pick it up again, it is the grip. If you shoot one shot, put down the gun and pick it up for the next and all groups suck, it is the grip, not you.
I will keep the BH, SBH and BFR grips, thank you.
Now the SRH grip is not bad, just use a firm hold. The RH has issues.

I haven't had a chance to read all the responses so forgive me if I duplicate what someone else has said. First yes I've seen the sight pins move and it should actually be a solid pin rather than an actual roll pin which is hollow and "rolled" out of a flat piece of metal. You can try one of two things, order a new pin as yours may be undersized or the more reasonable way to handle it is to use a tiny bit of the green loctite which is a sleeve retainer and designed to work on friction fitted parts.

As far as the shooting that's harder without being there to see what is going on. First I would get the gun on some sand bags or a decent rest and shoot at 25yds. Second is to work with consistency in your grip and trigger pull. If the gun does not already have at least a minimal action job with springs I would look at doing that. The next thing that causes problems are cylinder throats that are inconsistent or too small. To find out just pull the cylinder out and measure with a pair of calipers and be carefull to double check your measurements and write them down as you go and check for holes that may be too tight. The last is obvious but try different loads. If you reload try different bullets and charges if you don't try a different brand of ammo.

Hope that helps some.

The pin has NEVER been a roll pin on the Ruger. A slight bend in the middle will work. It is a 1/16" pin and all are a loose fit that can be pushed out with a pin. Usually the spring tension from the sight springs will hold it in.
Another thing to do is to shorten the pin a little and then upset the edge of the hole on each side with a little larger punch.
You can also flatten the end of the pin with a little hammer and put it back in.
Let the pin stick out a little and put some epoxy on it and push it back in. Then wipe excess off the gun and let it get hard. FIXED!
Tight panties will not work but it is, really, just a pin.