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Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: Fowler] #79412 12/07/2010 8:42 PM
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Whitworth Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Fowler
JWP475 you forgot the caribou pic! He was a goodun with a revolver!

You guys have understand JWP475 bought one of the first 2 or 3 475 Linebaughs Bowen ever built back in the late 80s and has been playing in the big bore game for a long time. He knows his stuff and likes big guns and big bullets. Hes been there and done that!

I am a big proponent of Seyfried and follow his, Linebaugh, and Keith's beliefs in heavy for caliber bullets. I think Ross is correct that the 45 colt is bar none the most versiltile handgun bullet out there if you have a 5 shot style revolver from Bowen or one of the custom smiths. There is really nothing a 454 can do that the 45 colt can't in a 5 shooter.

The one clevate to the 454 statement above is the 454 can drive light bullets faster than the 45 colt, it has more powder space. But I think 45 caliber hunting bullets start at 250gr and go up to 365gr reasonably. I think the worst thing that has been done to the 45 caliber guns for hunting is the advent of lighter than 250gr bullets for the 454s and 460 Smiths and intended to be used on big game. They were created as a marketing ploy to sell the big X frame guns. A 200gr Boat Tail bullet in a handgun? Driving this bullet at 2400fps? Is was and is a horrid idea on game that you respect and intend to eat. The bullet is a crippler if placed poorly, sure it probably get dramatic results if placed correctly on a broadside deer but sending one to work on a elk is just asking for a disaster! But it sure looks impressive in the add for the gun in Guns and Mayhem monthly magazine!

I personnally will stick to my 480 slinging heavy bullets at moderate velocities for elk but I also shoot 41 mags, 44sp (I have 2) and 45 colts (I have 5 of them) and follow similar thought processes for all of them.

Oh and I totally agree it is hard to prove a real advantage to anything 45 colt or bigger in the lower 48. I will also say this is a discussion that has been going on for 100 years with rifles and more recently with handguns and it is not likely to get settled here...


Very well said! Jwp's .475 was Bowen's first, actually! Too bad he no longer has it.......

Guns and Mayhem!! LOL! I like that!


Max Prasac

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BIG IRON: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6aXjMH5C30

Gun Digest TV's Modern Shooter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGo-KMpXPpA&t=7s

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: Whitworth] #79424 12/07/2010 11:42 PM
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cottonstalk Offline
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TC you'll love that gun.

Brush buster calibers?I don't think so.I'll go with the statement that there is nothing in the lower 48 that a 45colt can't handle,and I personally don't think there's nothing in NA it can't do,but there are calibers that could handle the big bears more efficiently.

JL said it best,"don't load your little gun up. Load your big gun normal. In other words, don't send a boy to do a man's job".

I'd rather be hit by a vette than run over by a mack.


"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence,try orderin' someone else's dog around" unknown cowboy
Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: jwp475] #79442 12/08/2010 1:31 AM
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wildcatter Offline
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[/quote]


Test target shooting through brush is problematic at best and the caliber is immaterial.

As to reading too much, I beg to differ at learned a lot shooting BIG GAME with handguns and have tested a lot of ammunition

Just a few of the animals that I have taken with a big bore revolver





















Enlighten us as to your experience shooting LARGEW GAMNE with the 454 and the 475/480

[/quote] Maybe a better question would be "how do those other guy's do it with .45's????????????????????????

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: wildcatter] #79461 12/08/2010 5:50 AM
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tradmark Offline
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i've already posted plenty of pics and have many more i could post if i'd ever bother to buy a scanner. i have 3 hunts planned for large over 500lb animals. have one in the works next year for both a waterbuffalo and a buffalo hunt for a bull where they regularly hit 2500lbs. our experiences differ, i just truly never saw a difference. i didn't want to, nor not want to see a difference. i noticed more difference with velocity in expanding bullets that would stay together and differences in meplat size, not caliber size as long as bullets are stabilized properly. btw, my son's bfr 454 stabilizes and has shown significantly better penetration with 400 grain pills than my FA, whereas i get better 100+ yard groups with 340gr and down bullets in the FA

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: wildcatter] #79469 12/08/2010 11:18 AM
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jwp475 Offline
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 Originally Posted By: wildcatter

Maybe a better question would be "how do those other guy's do it with .45's????????????????????????



How the 45 does what? How it kills, or how it compares to the bigger bores?

Of course I never stated that it wouldn't kill. I responded to your statements cpmparing the 45 Revolvers to the 475/480.

There is a difference on game between the 2 in the field just like there is a difference between a 30-06 and a 243

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: tradmark] #79471 12/08/2010 12:10 PM
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Whitworth Offline
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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
i've already posted plenty of pics and have many more i could post if i'd ever bother to buy a scanner. i have 3 hunts planned for large over 500lb animals. have one in the works next year for both a waterbuffalo and a buffalo hunt for a bull where they regularly hit 2500lbs. our experiences differ, i just truly never saw a difference. i didn't want to, nor not want to see a difference. i noticed more difference with velocity in expanding bullets that would stay together and differences in meplat size, not caliber size as long as bullets are stabilized properly. btw, my son's bfr 454 stabilizes and has shown significantly better penetration with 400 grain pills than my FA, whereas i get better 100+ yard groups with 340gr and down bullets in the FA


You missed the original point of the "discussion" where the statement was made that the .454 will always out penetrate the .480 -- or something to that effect.


Max Prasac

Semper Fidelis

BIG IRON: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6aXjMH5C30

Gun Digest TV's Modern Shooter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGo-KMpXPpA&t=7s

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: Whitworth] #79584 12/10/2010 5:58 AM
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tradmark Offline
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it won't always, but it will in many many instances though i'm not sure you'd find anything either wouldn't go all the way through with proper so loads so it's really a moot point. what i am really getting at is that not only is penetration a relationship of weight/velocity/bullet integrity, but also bullet stabilization.

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: tradmark] #79585 12/10/2010 12:42 PM
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Whitworth Offline
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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
it won't always, but it will in many many instances though


The reverse also holds true. There's nothing magical about the .454 in relation to the .45 Colt. You're not gaining any penetration with the increase in velocity potential -- that is unless you are using Punch bullets or something equally hard to degrade. Again, a great example of this is my .50 Alaskan and my .500 Linebaugh -- same bullet, and a 500 fps velocity spread and they will penetrate side by side. But one of them is nearly impossible to control -- the one that produces the high velocity.


Max Prasac

Semper Fidelis

BIG IRON: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6aXjMH5C30

Gun Digest TV's Modern Shooter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGo-KMpXPpA&t=7s

Re: 454 vs 480 [Re: Fowler] #79592 12/10/2010 3:32 PM
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jwp475 Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Fowler
JWP475 you forgot the caribou pic! He was a goodun with a revolver!

You guys have understand JWP475 bought one of the first 2 or 3 475 Linebaughs Bowen ever built back in the late 80s and has been playing in the big bore game for a long time. He knows his stuff and likes big guns and big bullets. Hes been there and done that!

I am a big proponent of Seyfried and follow his, Linebaugh, and Keith's beliefs in heavy for caliber bullets. I think Ross is correct that the 45 colt is bar none the most versiltile handgun bullet out there if you have a 5 shot style revolver from Bowen or one of the custom smiths. There is really nothing a 454 can do that the 45 colt can't in a 5 shooter.

The one clevate to the 454 statement above is the 454 can drive light bullets faster than the 45 colt, it has more powder space. But I think 45 caliber hunting bullets start at 250gr and go up to 365gr reasonably. I think the worst thing that has been done to the 45 caliber guns for hunting is the advent of lighter than 250gr bullets for the 454s and 460 Smiths and intended to be used on big game. They were created as a marketing ploy to sell the big X frame guns. A 200gr Boat Tail bullet in a handgun? Driving this bullet at 2400fps? Is was and is a horrid idea on game that you respect and intend to eat. The bullet is a crippler if placed poorly, sure it probably get dramatic results if placed correctly on a broadside deer but sending one to work on a elk is just asking for a disaster! But it sure looks impressive in the add for the gun in Guns and Mayhem monthly magazine!

I personnally will stick to my 480 slinging heavy bullets at moderate velocities for elk but I also shoot 41 mags, 44sp (I have 2) and 45 colts (I have 5 of them) and follow similar thought processes for all of them.

Oh and I totally agree it is hard to prove a real advantage to anything 45 colt or bigger in the lower 48. I will also say this is a discussion that has been going on for 100 years with rifles and more recently with handguns and it is not likely to get settled here...



Thanks. That Carribou is the best one that I have taken even with a rifle..

+1, to your post as it pertains to bullets and calibers for hunting

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