On Gary Reeder's last African Safari he used a 300 gr Sierra FP out of a 454 Casull to cleanly take a Massive Cape Buffalo (2 Shoulder Shots) The Sierra FP is unbonded, but has an incredibly tough lead core.

Who would have thought... I never knew the 300gr Sierra had that hard a lead core, however, I have a box of them that clearly states in red "NOT FOR USE IN COLT S.A.A. OR REPLICAS".....

That 300 gr Sierra FP would probably be perfectly suited for use in the 460 S&W.

I’m glad that we’re not reading his obituary! I’m glad that it worked for him....but for several reasons would “not” be my first choice! For large, thick skinned, heavily muscled/boned animals. lMO, 300 grains is extremely lacking in the sectional density department.....no matter the bullet! JMO memtb

Those bullets are that hard and tough. I have tested plenty of them.

Bullet choice is definitely a personal preference, and I truly get that. My main reason for even posting this, is to bring it to everyone's attention that different bullets react completely differently in different cartridges and at different velocities. This same bullet out of a 45 Colt wouldn't expand at all, and only mildly expands at 454 Casull velocities (nose and jacket just do begin to expand.) At 460 S&W and 450 Bushmaster velocities this bullet acts/expands like the highest priced bonded bullets.

But that’s not possible!

According to 100 other posts on here the only bullets good for anything above ground squirrels is the swift a frame or Barnes buster....

Bahahaha! Hahahahaha! Very funny, and unfortunately, very true! Those same guys have NO clue that the 300 gr Sierra FP in 44 caliber was specifically designed for the 445 Super Mag...that's why it basically acts like a cast bullet in the 44 Magnums, unless shot out of a long barreled TC or rifle.

Most bullets work quite well if placed correctly....

Yes Sir! ABSOLUTELY

I am so sick of hearing "A-frame" that I refer to that bullet as a Swift... Don`t get me wrong... its a great bullet but some people just ran it into the ground....

I've taken 3 Cape buffs with: .416 Taylor Encore 400 gr. Horn. Solid & 400 gr. DGX; .475 Linebaugh 275 gr. X. All were one shot kills.

Yup....and those same few have run many off of this forum.

Gary Reeders Cape buff taken with Sierra bullet from 454...

The 454 handload Reeder used to take his buff had a Sierra 300gr JFP over 25.5grs of 2400 shot from a 7 1/2" FA`s m-83. The photo shows the same bullet recovered from a blue wildebeest (taken during same hunt) losing 11.0grs. According to the handloader the recovered bullet from the buff could be relaoded again.....

Hey Doc, How much did the buff weigh that you shot with your 475 and the 275gr X ?????

They tried with me. I guess Elvis has left the building. Haven’t seen them in awhile. No?

James, didn't have scales handy! This was a very large cow buff about 90% the size of my #11 SCI bull. I was wanting the experiemce/excitement of hunting buff again, so I killed 2 cows on this trip significantly cheaper than my one bull combined.

never knew you took them

may be the last sunset for the dynamic duo and friends

You mean there are bullets that work that don't cost 2 or 3 each?

LOL

some of the best ones are very inexpensive and have been around for many, many years

I remember that it was so refreshing to see a handgunner take TWO Cape buff with his 454 using 300gr XTP`s a few years ago. I also remember shooting a Florida water buff using a 400gr XTP from my 475 and watching the reaction of the buff after the shot. It was as if it touched a live electric wire with its body completely shaking till it dropped... guess I should have used a Swift

OK, you guys stgarted this...
I have some Speer DeepCurls for my 480 Ruger in 325.gr. I have been keeping my eyes open for more but no luck. Do they still make the 400gr? Speer lists them but I also can't find them.

A year or two ago I kept getting told the Speer might work on moose & brown bear but I'd be better off with a "premium bullet".
Has anyone had a poor experience from the DeepCurl soft points in the large calibers on heavy critters?
I ordered some Penn Thunderheads in 420 a couple months ago but no word on them.
My one experience with heavy hardcast bullets on game was 410gr from a 450 Marlin Carbine at 1900+fps & I was underwhelmed so I'm thinking that long term I would like to try expanding.

Speer no longer makes the 400 gr .475 Deep Curls. To be 100 percent honest, the 480 Ruger and 475 Linebaugh really don't produce enough velocity to get the 400 gr Speers to expand. You need at least 1,600 fps to get decent expansion. My 475/350 Mag Competitor can make those bullets expand to catalog quality perfection. The 475 Maximum, 475 JDJ, and 475/500 JDJ should produce similar results.

You'd be exceptionally pleased with Woodleigh Weldcore bullets out of your 450 Narlin....another often overlooked option is the 480 gr Hornady DGX bonded...I have never been impressed with cast bullets, but some guys love them.

Ok, that's what I thought on 400gr production, but I looked this morning on their web-site & they still list it (although unavailable).
Any experience with the 325gr?

Yeah... The moose died so I guess all was well but multiple shots in the lungs at under 100yds. Could have covered them all with a spread hand. He just kept going till I got in a high shoulder/spine shot. My partner thought I was missing.

I've had very similar cast bullet results and I don't use them...ever.

Hopefully some of the other guys will chime in about the 325 gr bullets...I can't comment because I've only used the 400 gr versions.

I've seen moose in Alaska do the very same thing with 338 win mags in the lungs. They act like they haven't been shot at all until they final realize they are dead

In the picture that jamesfromjersey posted with the cape buffalo the shots seem to be just a bit low. I must admit I've never shot one and probably never will, but them just seem a little low.

One of the shots was too low for my liking also, but those two shots obviously worked.....and with a traditional, standard bullet......and he went down quickly and was found before the hyenas ate him. 😉

Gary Reeder stated in his write-up about the hunt that the first shot was low and broke the shoulder and a quick follow-up shot took out both lungs and put it down quickly. He was borrowing another hunters equipment.

I’m just glad that this place seems to be becoming a more invitingly happy place and less the guarded, egotistical, agenda driven, narrow minded, exclusive place that it was in the past when I joined.

Makes me happy and feel like there could actually be a future.

I agree! This was the BEST site anywhere when it pertained to handgun hunting...hopefully, we're headed back in the right direction now.

Yes!!!!!

It was best back when the average dummy up a holler somewhere told their story of their regular old normal handgun hunt for deer or a ground hog etc etc. plus reported on their guns and loads with thoughts and opinions thrown in.
Too many think they are “professional” or something lol.

🤷🏻‍♂️

This is what I have read all over that they don't make them, but as you did, I saw them on their website and ordered some! If you need pictures, I have proof!

haha

This unfortunately was before the COVID frenzy though, so now I imagine they are out of stock like everything else.

Been a bit since I have posted on here, sounds like lots of drama I wasn't aware of!

Pretty awesome bull the Gary Reeder got with a 454 and old school bullets!

I have read up on those Sierra's a bunch, seem similar to the old FA bullets with really hard lead and thick jacket. If I remember, Sierra says its the hardest lead core of any bullet they have made. I have not tried them myself but have been tempted; they look good and are very reasonably priced as mentioned.

proof is in the puddin!

REALLY?

THIS IS FREAKIN AWESOME!! Seriously, the best news that I've heard in a while!! (About the Speer 400 gr .475 bullets) Thank you so much for letting everyone know.

No problem!!

Sorry it took a while to post about them, I was going to make a post a while back when I got them but forgot!

Hopefully they keep them in the mix from here on out

I bought a bunch of those 400 grain speer slugs for my 475L. Shot a few of them, but ended up settling on some of those cast hollow points from Dick Thompson. I need to find those speer bullets and post them for sale. I'll never use them.

Brenden, I've been shopping for them so PM me with a price. I may be interested!

At the same time, curious why you chose not to use them if you want to share...

Franchise, is there an article or anything I can read about Gary's buffalo hunt?

Thanks

Reedercustomguns.net/forum/ you may have to scroll down a little, but it's all there & no problem buddy!!

The thing I like most about the Sierra 300 grain 45 caliber bullets, they are the most accurate bullets I have found. ( in my 454) Sighting in a new scope using my standard hunting recipe, printed a clover leaf, all touching at the initial 40 yard sight in.
They are tough bullets, that hold together well. I’ve personally taken many large animals with these bullets, ( Moose, Bear, Bison , Boar) and always try to break them down with shoulder shots. I have only recovered 2 bullets, as they mostly go on thru, even on shoulder shots.

Sierra bullet next to JDJ

Recovered Sierra bullet from Gary Reeders Cape buffalo. Weight is 288grs.....

That is excellent weight retention

The above performance results are virtually identical to the same Sierra 300 gr FP in 44. This bullet truly needs 460 S&W velocities to expand...as the 44 cal version needs 445 Super Mag velocities to expand....I've always liked seeing what different bullets, in different weights, in different calibers did, on various animals of differing weights...that's the only way you can honestly give true and accurate advice....ps....this is an unbounded, inexpensive, jacket bullet....I know....impossible....right 😉🤔......The gentlemen who have used this bullet that have commented in this thread know exactly what I'm talking about.......

Impossible.

Good to see that even after the brief HH hiatus, Franchise is still fighting the good online fight

Regarding the Speer 325 and 400, I have shot them both out of my 475 JDJ, with stellar results on feral hogs. Like the others that have commented previously, it takes a fair amount of velocity to perform and expand. In my Linebaughs, I've stuck with XTP's, Barnes and the like for storebought offerings, but these days I'm more and more apt to run sixhsots cast HP's at sedate velocities

The bullet recovered from the Cape Buffalo is very similar in looks and performance to the original Freedom Arms bullets. They were excellent big heavy game bullets

Sierra has been my go to for years for everything up to elk....haven’t chased anything bigger....but I’m satisfied.

You dummies gotta get woke! The bullet that killed Kennedy was a prototype A-frame. They really are magic! But Epstein still didn't kill himself.

From what I see on midway site the hornady xtp is discontinued in 475? The Sierra is not available in 475... looks like the 325 speed deep curl is the only "standard" .475 jacketed soft point available.

Vance
If you were interested in the .475 Speer in the 400gr flavor, I got mine right from the Speer website. they have it listed still, but it is currently sold out like everything right now.

Vance,

I'll find my stash of 400 grain speer slugs this weekend and let you know. I think I have 120 or so.

Thanks Brenden, let me know

I will be keeping my eyes open

I never thought I would see one of these bullets even remotely expanded. any idea on the velocity he got on that load?

PER loaddata.com THE LOAD's MV WOULD HAVE BEEN LOW 1,400's. GARY USED A BORROWED REVOLVER FROM BEARSKINNER, WHO HAS NOT CHRONO'ed THE LOAD BUT HAS BEEN VERY HAPPY WITH ITS ACCURACY AND PERFORMANCE. IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THIS BULLET HAS BEEN DISCONTINUED.

Sierra still lists them on their website. They are out of stock now, unfortunately like most other bullets. They are backordered on every legitimate seller of handloading components too. Hopefully, later this summer, they'll be available to us shooters again.

Something that has me puzzled is how did he use a 7 1/2" revolver, I thought the minimum barrel length was now 8". Anyway, me & some others are headed to Africa soon & I'll be taking my bisley 45 that I just had re barreled with an 8 1/2" because we were told that was the law in South Africa, plus all six guns have to be scoped. That was the law when I was there last time, the only difference was you could take 3 guns & now you can only take two.
Anyway I'll be using strictly cast bullets, same thing I've used for the last 50+ years & over 100 head of game, I hope they still work. In the bisley 45 I'll use a 306 gr LBT solid of my own alloy as my primary bullet & also a 282 gr HP in certain cases depending on the animal.
I won't be shooting Buffalo or any other dangerous game so I don't expect to recover any bullets, I seldom ever do. My other gun will be a Ruger 10.5" 357 Maximum using 182 gr LBT solids, again made from my own alloy & running about 1600 fps.
I don't know the velocities on the 45, I don't have the gun back yet, I'll pick it up in a few days when I get to the NRA Center in Raton, NM. I know from past experience on moose & several elk that these bullets always exit & I've never had to shoot one twice.
Using the solids I've shot them through live 7" Quaken Aspens with an exit & also shot them through 9 water jugs so they should work just fine on Kudu, Nyala, Zebra, Sable, etc.
That was quite an accomplishment by Gary Reeder, to borrow a gun & knock off a possible world record Cape Buffalo, hope he gets his guns back!

Dick

If someone knows for sure I would really like to know about the 8" barrel requirement in South Africa. Did Gary really use a 7 1/2" barrel? If so I would like to take my FA 7 1/2" 41 magnum but not if it isn't allowed. Any help here would be appreciated, thanks!

Dick

Not sure where you got the idea that there was a restriction on barrel length or a requirement for a scope. I hunted South Africa in 2014 and used 71/2" barrel SRH. I believe the regulations only stipulate that the revolver is designed for hunting and not personal defense. The scope goes towards being designed for hunting but I don't believe its mandatory. (I used a reflex type sight).

However, if I was going in the near future I'd be contacting one of the specialty firearm permit services eg Gracy Travel, Rifle Permits etc and get up to date informed advice.

ps Paying one of these services to process your permits and provide a meet and greet service prevents a lot of problems. Also gets you through SA Police check in a few minutes rather than hours. Best money you can spend.

Yes, you need at least an 8” barrel and a sight ( not open) scope, dot etc. No semi autos. The FA83 used by the two gentlemen in Africa has a 9 1/4” barrel. OAL. This is South Africa, SAPS legal. ( to obtain a permit) Other countries may be different, and may change at will.

Thanks bearskinner, so does that mean from the front of the frame to the end of the barrel was 7 1/2' but the overall length was 9 1/4", making it legal?
Debbie Gracy was in Zimbawbe yesterday when she called me & we didn't have very good reception so it was kind of muddled.
Hopefully I hear from her today & thanks again for the help.

Dick

The OAL of the barrel, including the permanent brake.
Remember, just because this is the legal requirements this year, who knows what requirements may be asked for next year!

I was lucky when I brought my 6" 500WE... in the photo to the left

As of now the requirements have not changed. There working on our SAPS permits now for September-October. I will be taking the same two handguns as they have performed wonderfully for the past many years. Slight change on bullets. I’ll load test some 300 grain XTP’s in the FA83. As long as there about the same accuracy, I’ll use approx the same load. The XTP might open up slightly to inflict a little more trauma.

BEARSKINNER: IF YOU USE THE 300gr XTP MAGS IN THE 1,400fps RANGE I DO NOT KNOW IF THEY WILL OPEN UP OR JUST ACT AS A RN BULLET. I SUGGEST THAT YOU DO SOME WATER JUG, OR OTHER APPROPRIATE MEDIA, TESTING.

I am going next year, and everything I'm seeing for South Africa says barrel must be 4" or longer. Actually the rule states a metric size that is slightly less than 4".
Also see that you cannot take 2 guns of the same caliber. I don't get that rule.
I planning on taking a 5" Super Redhawk in 44, and or a 12" Contender in 375 Win.

I will be at customs first thing tomorrow, registering one of my 500 Linebaugh’s. Everyone is sending me Lion charge videos, not to mention this one is a custom Reeder with a Lion engraved on each side of the cylinder. I have lots of great .510 bullets to test too.
I shoot revolvers well, and much prefer having 5 quick shots with heavy bullets. Ya never know!

A few years ago I posted two Cape buff shot by a gent from the south using 300gr XTP mag bullets from his 454. He went on to say that the XTP`s were recommended by Freedom. Anyway, I wish you all the luck in the world...

Dick, on every trip I've made to SA I've taken 3 handguns- never questioned about it. I've taken 7 1/2" revolvers and 5" revolvers. Never questioned about it. I don't think the guys in SAPS know how to use a ruler anyway!
Gracy Travel keeps up to date on all this. They OKed what I wrote above.
Lion & elephant charges are cool, especially when you're involed. I was in one on the lion-27 yds; elephant-12 yds. Wish I'd used a revolver, but my single shot .416 Taylor gave me all the excitement I could ask for!

Thanks Doc, good to know. I might just throw in my 6.5" 480 bisley also.

Dick

Sixshot, Ask your PH what is required in the region you are going to. They will be knowledgeable week in and out as to what’s legal. You don’t want to donate a gun to customs, or spend extra time there.

You're correct, I'll do that tomorrow!

Dick

I emailed the SAPS Central Firearms Registry about this issue. Their reply was:

"The Firearms Control Act, (Act 60/2000), does not specify what the minimum requirements for the length of a barrel must be, nor that the firearm must be fitted with optical sights. I am not familiar with any written document or instruction which regulates barrel lengths. However, the applicant must motivate the suitability of the firearm he/ she intend to use and for what kind of hunting he will use the firearm. He/ she will follow the normal procedure for the import of the firearm."

That being said, we all know that what should happen isn't always what does happen. I would strongly recommend using the services of Gracy Travel or similar company, taking the advice of your PH and having letters confirming the intended use of the gun being specifically for hunting.

On the April trip, we used Gracie Travel, had Anne at Air2000 and her guys gather us up , run us thru customs, to and from. Customs pulled every gun, opened all the ammo, counted every round, matched the head stamped brass to the firearms. Wrote everything down in a ledger with copy’s of our SAPS permits. Pretty easy leaving SA.
Returning to SA in September/October we breezed thru, they barely looked at the firearms, and never looked at the ammo……… so you never know who is going to be checking and how through they will be.
Having both handguns scoped and 9”&12” barrels, I felt much more at ease. Many of my hunting handguns are 7 1/2” barrels. Maybe, it would passed thru un-noticed, or, it could have been confiscated, and myself detained. Neither of which I wanted to experience.
Is it a law? Or is it just a recommendation? I don’t know. I have no desire to tempt fate.