Traditions BP Pistol
#70378
06/02/2010 11:11 PM
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lamina1982
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So I've had this for a bit now (got from a fellow member)but not got to shoot yet. Just put the leupold 2x on today and hoping to test fire on fri. Its a 50 cal tradition buckhunter, uses #11 caps. Anyone else shooting one of these? Any specific load data, I got some 350 gr (I think) FPB Hornady-on sale rack so well see what those do.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70388
06/03/2010 12:49 AM
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Bob Roach
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I am guessing that you will use some sort of Black Powder substitute? I think I would start off with about a 25 grain equivelent dose of Powder or Pellets, and start working up about 5 grains at a time. I would work up and not start with a maximum load. At some point I would think recoil should start to get serious in this package with a 350 grain bullet. By working up to that point you will be able to tell pretty much what you can handle.
See You At The Range
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70402
06/03/2010 3:31 AM
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doc with a glock
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Lam,
I don't have a traditions in that form, have a Traditions Flintlock and Percussion, also have a T/C Scout in 50 caliber.
Doc
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70404
06/03/2010 3:44 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
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s4s4u
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That's the best lookin' one of them I've seen. Agree with not getting carried away with macho load at first, fifty grains might be all that short tube can eat. Looks like fun.
Rod, too.
Short cuts often lead to long recoveries.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: s4s4u]
#70407
06/03/2010 4:09 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
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Tigger
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Dirt burning, smoke belching, ball throwing FUN!!!!
Keep us posted.
NRA Life Member
** NEVER! Moon a Werewolf!!**
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Tigger]
#70408
06/03/2010 4:52 AM
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Joined: Apr 2009
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minnesotahunter
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I like it!!
Do they still make those?
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: minnesotahunter]
#70413
06/03/2010 11:43 AM
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pter1020k
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very nice i would not mind having one.
Genesis chapter 1 verse 26
When shooting a single shot their are no warning shots.
Keith
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: minnesotahunter]
#70414
06/03/2010 11:44 AM
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lamina1982
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No, apparently they stopped a yr or so ago- I was lucky a fellow member still had one he hadnt used much. They were redisgning and introducing a new one with a 209 primer and break open, saw a pic on specialty pistol but no real details on when was gonna be released
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70417
06/03/2010 12:26 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,378
Darrell H
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Neat looking pistol and I love the "portable" size of it. I have never shot one of those but I have sent several rounds downrange from T/C muzzleloading pistols. Here is my 13 3/8" Bullberry: My current load is 70 grains of Blackhorn 209 and a 240 grain Hornady XTP or Remington JSP. Blackhorn requires a 209 primer so you would probably not get reliable ignition with Blackhorn and a #11 cap. I would suggest GOEX 3F, Pyrodex P, or 3F Triple 7 in your short barrel. I'm looking forward to hearing how your gun shoots, please keep us posted!
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70419
06/03/2010 12:32 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
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Bob Roach
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I did a little looking, with no luck. The rifle loading information with saboted bullets recomends 75 - 90 grains and an absolute Max of 100. I believe with a short barreled handgun the maximum will be much lower. Probably in the range of 60 - 75 grains would be a good guess on a maximum load. From the picture the gun looks fairly strong, but I would work up carefully. I would still start out at 25 or 30 and start working up. This will give you a chance to get used to recoil before it starts to get unpleasant. In the reply above the load is 70 grains with a 240 in a TC. With you using a 350 grain bullet recoil will be heavier.
I agree with s4s4u it is a very nice looking package. Now if it will shoot accurately.
NOTE: You probably know this, Keep a Scope Cover on when cleaning. Just thought about that.
Be Safe, Keep it Clean, and Enjoy. With luck it should shoot well for you. Keep us posted on your progress, and results.
See You At The Range
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70445
06/03/2010 5:43 PM
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lamina1982
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Factory lists 80gr as max. I am new to muzzleloading so tommorow should be quite the adventure. Ill prob grab some smaller bullets as well to try.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70485
06/04/2010 1:07 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
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Bob Roach
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I had a second barrel made up for the wifes Hawken. It was a semi custom gun built around 30 years ago, and I did not want to mess with the original barrel. I found probably the last breachplug in captivity for it from the maker, marked pattern. Used one of Ed's radius rifled barrels made carbine length for it. It is now a Hawken Buggy Carbine in 54.
When we got her Hawken all together, I put together 4 thicknesses of patches, and .530 and .535 round balls, and started trying them out to see what combination of patch and ball had the best accuracy, and could be loaded with ease. Then we had the powder charges. This was a lengthy process working this out. Loading clean, loading dirty, and accuracy, plus keeping recoil aceptable for the wife. After I determined a load we had the gunsmith build her a powder measure for it. Wouldn't you know it, It takes a different patch thickness and a different ball size than my 54 Hawken.
The point here is take your time working up a load. Try different bullets and powder charges. Using black powder substitute powders you might need to try out more than one. You might give pellets a try also. Lots of variables. Look at CCI MAGNUM Caps. Most everyone I know uses RWS or CCI caps, and lots are switching from RWS to CCI as they are much easier to get, and they work fine.
Let us know how your range day turnes out.
See You At The Range
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70507
06/04/2010 10:44 PM
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huntkng
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You didn't say what caliber your Traditions is?? Mine is a "Trapper" .50 w/ a 1 in 20 twist and set triggers, but I know they made them in a .45. With round balls I use 45 - 60 gr's FFG. With conical and sabots I've used more...but it wasn't as fun (it hurt!).
Bill in OR
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70508
06/04/2010 10:47 PM
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lamina1982
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So I did some shooting today-no real groups just getting used to the gun. I used pyrodex p powder as gun store said you can't shoot pellets with an 11 cap. Is that true?? it was a great joy shooting this gun-the cleaning and such not so much but it was new and pretty cool. I also picked up some tc 250 gr sabot (yellow tips).. I mostly shot those...I started at 30 and worked up to 70 just testing recoil. 70 was pretty stout but definitely less than the 4" 500 lol. I tried the 350gr FPB-those suckers are really hard to get started in barrel!! once started not so bad, but jeesh. Started at 50gr with those-perfect bullseye at 30 yds!! Went up 70 gr and that was pretty sharp-gun recoils well though-hits ya right in palm so nicely. Where the 500 smacks the web of thumb. I definitley see how this will take a while to figure out exact load data with different bulets. It definitely was fun though. I got the 223 encore dialed in better too--then had woodchuck fever and missed a super close one (30 yds)..oh boy. I do use the CCI magnum caps so maybe I should try pellets? That pyrodex kinda stinky huh?
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70509
06/04/2010 10:50 PM
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lamina1982
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How do you keep scope lense from getting all black? Those caps really make a mess on some shots!!
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70511
06/05/2010 1:05 AM
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Joined: May 2008
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pter1020k
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clear scope covers and glass cleaner wipes
Genesis chapter 1 verse 26
When shooting a single shot their are no warning shots.
Keith
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: pter1020k]
#70512
06/05/2010 2:07 AM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,655
wapitirod
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You've received a lot of good advice but one thing to also check are your local regulations where you will be hunting. For example here in oregon hi'vis sights, closed ignition, centerfire primers, pelletized powders, and sabots are illegal during muzzle loader season. It seems like we are one of the more restrictive states but it pays to check, no need playing with sabots or pellet powder if it's agains the law.
I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them. John Wayne-The Shootist
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: wapitirod]
#70513
06/05/2010 2:35 AM
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pter1020k
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ny requires single shot loaded through muzzle.minimum .45 cal.single projectile for ammo.powder pellets, scopes and sabotes are all ok.
lamina you have a great gun there. any chance you would loan it to me for muzzle loader season???
Genesis chapter 1 verse 26
When shooting a single shot their are no warning shots.
Keith
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70514
06/05/2010 2:52 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,608
s4s4u
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gun store said you can't shoot pellets with an 11 cap. Is that true?? BS
Rod, too.
Short cuts often lead to long recoveries.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: s4s4u]
#70527
06/05/2010 12:24 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 577
lamina1982
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This will be my first ever muzzleloader season..so sorry pter1020k. Thanks s4s4u..cause that powder measureing is a bit of a pain!! Guess ill pick up some 30 gr pellets next time I'm out. Thanks again for all the info guys-i'll keep you posted on my adventures and hopefully will get a deer this year. It sure is fun to shoot!!!!!!
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: lamina1982]
#70528
06/05/2010 12:26 PM
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guitarpicva
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This will be my first ever muzzleloader season..so sorry pter1020k. Thanks s4s4u..cause that powder measureing is a bit of a pain!! Guess ill pick up some 30 gr pellets next time I'm out. Thanks again for all the info guys-i'll keep you posted on my adventures and hopefully will get a deer this year. It sure is fun to shoot!!!!!! Powder measuring isn't so bad with speed loaders and a good measure. There are even speed loaders with a powder measure on the side (clear). I use Blackhorn 209 and would never go back to BP or any of the other substitutes.
guitarpicva |||||| [o] VA AC4IY ...How long will you go limping between two different opinions? If the LORD is God, follow him; ... 1 Kings 18
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: guitarpicva]
#70532
06/05/2010 1:16 PM
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Bob Roach
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You are using an inline with caps instead of 209 shotgun primers. So you do not have nearly as much flash to ignite a pellet. However since you are using an inline I would give Pellets a try with CCI Magnum Caps. If they do ignite 100% of the time, they would be handy to use.
NOTE: I think I would try the Pellet without a bullet infront of it to make sure it will fire first. If the Breach unscrews so that you can get the bullet and pellet out incase it does not fire, this is probably not as big an issue.
Just took a look in the Midway Catalog. Looks like they have 5 different designs of Quick Loaders. One of them should work for you.
See You At The Range
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70536
06/05/2010 1:43 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 287
Al in OK
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Good lookin' piece! In a pistol, I have never shot black powder at all, but I shoot a T\C white mountain carbine and started using vorderlader-zundhutchen (that's a mouth full, I know) #11 caps, and boy do they make a difference! I had some trouble with the other brands misfiring, but these babies are hot!
Gun Control - A theory; A belief that a violent predator who ignores the laws prohibiting them from killing their fellow human beings will obey a law telling them they cannot own a gun.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Al in OK]
#70555
06/05/2010 3:21 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 779
Okie Hunter
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I have a 15 inch 209X50 Encore. Mine likes 100 grs. of Triple 7 and a saboted 300 gr. 45 cal. XTP. I don't know what the powder limit is on your gun. I have shot deer and wild hog with mine. I've heard the same thing on #11 caps and pellets but I think thats just for sidelock muzzle loaders. My wifes dad uses these in his TC Thunderhawk.
With God all things are possible. Matt.19:26
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Okie Hunter]
#70558
06/05/2010 3:59 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 287
Al in OK
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Yes, in a sidelock, the hotter the primer the better. I would think that the inlines would be easier, but I still want whatever is hottest, for the same reason. My inline is 209, but I still love my sidelock, even though my eyes are not so good for open sights anymore. would love to find some old brass optics to mount on it. Any way, the CCI caps would work well on it and would be easier to find, but if you happen to find the german caps, they have my vote.
Gun Control - A theory; A belief that a violent predator who ignores the laws prohibiting them from killing their fellow human beings will obey a law telling them they cannot own a gun.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Al in OK]
#70570
06/05/2010 8:17 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 7,331
TCTex.
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Deep Thought… do you have a mule ear black powder??? Duane
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb Benjamin Franklin
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: TCTex.]
#70576
06/05/2010 10:02 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 287
Al in OK
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Nope. Wish I did though. they look like fun.I just have an old T\C side hammer carbine. by sidelock are you talking about a mulie? if so, pardon my terminology.
Gun Control - A theory; A belief that a violent predator who ignores the laws prohibiting them from killing their fellow human beings will obey a law telling them they cannot own a gun.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Al in OK]
#70581
06/06/2010 12:20 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 7,331
TCTex.
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OK, I think am understanding you know. You are saying side lock to clarify it isn’t an inline. I have had a couple of TC traditional black powder rifles before and they are great guns. Here is a picture of a mule ear lock. They are neat locks!
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb Benjamin Franklin
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: TCTex.]
#70608
06/06/2010 12:42 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 287
Al in OK
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Yeah, they look great. I've seen a few pics of 4 barrel mules in the past, but they look heavy. Wouldn't mind having a single tube tho. TCMan, what's your fav cal in an encore?
Gun Control - A theory; A belief that a violent predator who ignores the laws prohibiting them from killing their fellow human beings will obey a law telling them they cannot own a gun.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Bob Roach]
#70609
06/06/2010 12:46 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 287
Al in OK
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Also Lamina1982, If the nipple on the pistol is a standard size, you might go with a musket nipple, provided that the hammer will strike it properly.
Gun Control - A theory; A belief that a violent predator who ignores the laws prohibiting them from killing their fellow human beings will obey a law telling them they cannot own a gun.
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Al in OK]
#70618
06/06/2010 3:33 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 779
Okie Hunter
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Doc, is your Scout a rifle or pistol? I would like to see pictures of it. If I got another black powder pistol, it would have to be a Scout (if I could find one). I just like the looks of them.
With God all things are possible. Matt.19:26
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Okie Hunter]
#70633
06/06/2010 5:45 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 577
lamina1982
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Well Ive had great ignition with the 11 caps with loose powder so if wont ignite pellets maybe ill try that-would really like to conver it to 209
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Re: Traditions BP Pistol
[Re: Al in OK]
#70651
06/07/2010 12:09 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
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TCTex.
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TCMan, what's your fav cal in an encore? I really like my 270 Win, but it has to do with sentimental variables more than efficiency to shoot. If I was going to have to start over again for any reason I would look at a 7mm08 or 308 and a 338-06 AI.
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb Benjamin Franklin
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